Greenhouse with direct access from house

[Hastings]

Has anyone here got a Greenhouse that has direct access from their house?

 

Just been informed by building control that this is not allowed even though it is in our building warrant (approved by them 3 years ago).

 

We want the added thermal properties a greenhouse will give to the house but we don't want the additional expense of a conservatory (full insulation). There is already a concrete slab in place left over from the demolished extension that we can re-use.

[PeterW]

4 minutes ago, Hastings said:

Just been informed by building control that this is not allowed even though it is in our building warrant (approved by them 3 years ago).

 

We want the added thermal properties a greenhouse will give to the house but we don't want the additional expense of a conservatory (full insulation).

As long as there is an external grade door between the two it doesn’t affect the building warrant or regulations ..? Why are they saying it isn’t allowed.?

[ProDave]

If it was agreed on the building warrant drawing tell the BCO that is what you must build to to comply with the building warrant.

 

Or if not already built, get it signed off and then add the greenhouse to save the argument.

[Hastings]

There is a new external grade door between the two.

They say it is due to the definitions (in the domestic technical guide) of a greenhouse and conservatory:

 

 

 

 

They say it has to be one or the other. But I don't agree, because there is no definition of 'porch' in the regulations.

[Hastings]

2 minutes ago, ProDave said:

If it was agreed on the building warrant drawing tell the BCO that is what you must build to to comply with the building warrant.

BCO said the one on the drawings is not compliant and we must submit an amendment for approval before building anything. I asked if he could look at the whole warrant to check for any more compliancy mistakes and he said no, that it was not their job to check.

 

[joe90]

Then why not call it a conservatory?, I have one and I grow plants In it 🤷‍♂️

[joe90]

1 minute ago, Hastings said:

BCO said the one on the drawings is not compliant

Why not?

[Ferdinand]

I'm not very au fait with this except that I added a secondhand conservatory to the back of a house, with a real tin roof and more insulation. So it was no longer a conservatory - no idea what it was, as everyone calls it a conservatory.

 

My considered strategy was that it was behind the house so no one could see it, and nearly exempt from PP as was except that it was 4.2m deep - just over the 4m limit, and therefore not to tell anyone anything, build it well, and keep stum until enforcement became impossible.

Which has now happened.

 

Given that the knowledge is out, can you argue that it is something else, or arrange for that to be the case, eg glass porch or covered yard?

 

Alternatively you could brick up or otherwise seal the door so it meets the defn of a greenhouse, and unblock it later after any inspection. Something like a light wooden framework and cladding plus a few shelves would do it.

 
F

[Hastings]

BCO says it cannot be a greenhouse (access from house) and therefore must be a conservatory and must conform to the 'Conservatories Guide' document, which states full insulation (d/glazing, walls and floor) even if not heated.

 

Maybe I argue it is an ancillary building, not further defined in the regulations.

Edited September 27, 2022 by Hastings

[Ferdinand]

10 minutes ago, Hastings said:

BCO says it cannot be a greenhouse (access from house) and therefore must be a conservatory and must conform to the 'Conservatories Guide' document, which states full insulation (d/glazing, walls and floor) even if not heated.

 

Sounds like you have a door to block, other considerations not intervening.

 

Or see if it meets the definition of "porch".

 

But do look up "covered yard" in Scotland. In England it is something which exists in law, but is not precisely defined anywhere - so very useful. I made a similar "covered way" - basically what here we call a "lean to", which is a weather protected wide walking route. Then added the door into the house 2 years later to give my tenant a laundry / dog space. Saved a lot of form-filling. and some fees. 

 

 

[ProDave]

1 minute ago, Hastings said:

BCO says it cannot be a greenhouse (access from house) and therefore must be a conservatory and must conform to the 'Conservatories Guide' document, which states full insulation (d/glazing, walls and floor) even if not heated.

Have you started building, not quite following?  Once BCO has approved drawings you then build to what is approved.  If they are questioning it, it sounds like building warrant not yet issued and you have not started building.  In which case if you really really want a greenhouse, delete it from the plans, get building, and add it after completion certificate is issued.

[Mr Punter]

I think this is just a Scottish thing.  Move south of the border and they don't care how you do a connie as long as you have external doors to the main house.

[joe90]

Yup, add it later or block up that door temporally (very weak Mortor) 😇

[Ferdinand]

@Hastings. I have the musical answer to all your questions 😛.

 

 

[Hastings]

@ProDaveBeen building for 4 years with the warrant, approaching completion mid-Nov without the greenhouse. Haven't been able to get it built in time. Was on the point of paying a deposit on a greenhouse for installation next year when I thought I should check with BCO it didn't need engineering approval as it was visually identical but not structurally different (no RSJs) to the one on the approved engineer's drawings.

[Hastings]

Thanks for all the ideas everyone.

I suspect now there will be other non-compliance issues that emerge when they come to inspect what is built. Does anyone know my 'rights', if any, when it comes to them finding fault with elements of the build that were shown on the approved building warrant?

[Hastings]

54 minutes ago, Hastings said:

They say it has to be one or the other. But I don't agree, because there is no definition of 'porch' in the regulations.

Correction to my first post: there is a definition of Porch:

"Porch means a building attached to and providing a covered entrance to a dwelling. "

 

Sounds exactly like what I want to build. A big porch and not a greenhouse "used primarily for growing plants".

 

[ProDave]

The Scottish system they are supposed to pick the drawings to bits right at the start and only when they are happy with all the details do they issue the building warrant and you start.  as long as you pay the fee whenever requested to renew the building warrant on a slow build (the time seems discretionary) then whatever version of regs was in force at the start remains, e.g we were building to the 2013 version of the regs.

 

To avoid argument, I would just complete without the greenhouse.  The greenhouse is not necessary to meet building regs.  If they are really going to be jobsworths, they could ask you to submit an amendment to remove the greenhouse from the drawings, they talked about that with me and I more or less told the BC officer that it would be impossible to update the drawings now as the architect firm had gone out of business, so they did not enforce that.  My case was the plans showed 2 stoves and i had only installed one.

[Hastings]

@ProDave

 

Should be no issue removing it from drawings as we already have other stuff not built like a detached garage, a second stove plus we have replaced the composting toilet with a standard flushing system etc.

 

Yes, I think we will complete without the greenhouse. So you think we would be covered by the original building warrant if we build it after, even though it is strictly non-compliant?

Edited September 28, 2022 by Hastings

[ProDave]

Build it as a permitted development building after completion.

[Hastings]

I believe we would still require a building warrant even under permitted development as it will be >8sqm. We will need it to be accepted as a Porch also.

[ProDave]

Only if you tell anyone