Wood pellet boilers

[Gordo]

I thought it may be an interesting topic to discuss wood pellet boilers and what people think of them. 
 

I have a GEE wood pellet boiler installed approximately 7 years now and while it has not been as cheap to run as promoted at the time it has been quite reliable and economical. It is not a system for everyone what with storage of pellets, loading pellets, emptying ash occasionally and constant desire to keep  adjust the settings and the infrequent repairs that crop up are the domaine of specialists with know how and  correct parts.

[SteamyTea]

The general opinion on here, and predecessor website, is that pellet boiler were not worth the bother or expense.

And then there is the 'carbon neutral' miss accounting that makes gas no worse environmentally.

[markc]

We have loads of tree surgeon customers and several of them have wood chip burners …. All hate them, only upside is the free fuel but they say that’s not worth the hassle.

[Trw144]

1 hour ago, markc said:

We have loads of tree surgeon customers and several of them have wood chip burners …. All hate them, only upside is the free fuel but they say that’s not worth the hassle.

 

Comes down to installing decent quality kit, and correctly installed (no different to the many heat pump issues that crop up on this site). The issue I come across with tree surgeons is its often not the best quality chip (usually lots of brash and bark so the boiler needs setting up accordingly), and they don't allow it to dry out to a suitable moisture content.

[SteamyTea]

1 hour ago, markc said:

wood chip burners

 

8 minutes ago, Trw144 said:

not the best quality chip

The OP is on about pellets, though there are issues with pellet quality.

[Trw144]

2 minutes ago, SteamyTea said:

 

The OP is on about pellets, though there are issues with pellet quality.

 

Generally pellet quality is good in the UK if you stick with certified pellets, and ensure if it is a blown delivery then the pressures are kept sensible (distances kept to circa 15/20m max, and ensure the driver doesn't turn the pressures up so he can get home for his tea).

[Jilly]

I looked into this, but aside from not having the space, it seems counterintuitive to be tied to buying a processed, carted wood product.  

[Trw144]

11 hours ago, Jilly said:

I looked into this, but aside from not having the space, it seems counterintuitive to be tied to buying a processed, carted wood product.  

I'm looking to put a pellet boiler with manual fill hopper on the side that will contain approximately 200kg (roughyly 1000kWh of energy) -  it isn't actually that space hungry. Running costs likely to be similar to an air source heat pump and as far as I see it, either way we're at the mercy of a fuel supplier.

[Pocster]

I initially looked at these . But the cost and hassle made it not viable .

[Declan52]

I have been using a pellet boiler for 7 years now and it's done what is meant to do. Mine is sited in my sunroom so it's more stylish looking than the other larger units that hold a few hundred kg of pellets. Mine at most will hold 25kg loaded in via a hatch on the top of the stove. 

When I made the choice to go down this route near 9 years ago wood pellet systems where very popular in NI so had plenty of options to where I could buy one plus very good access to servicing etc. Once our local knobs in government messed up the RHI scheme which resulted in it closing, the whole renewable industry in NI died overnight. For the past 5 years any repairs that where required I done them myself. Luckily enough they are used widespread in the rest of the EU so there is plenty of websites to help. Same goes with servicing. I strip it down once a year and clean it all out. 

In total I have replaced the burn pot twice and the air intake sensor twice. Approximately £300 costs for 7 years isn't that bad. 

We are lucky  that balcas have a factory here making wood pellets so I have easy access to fuel. The cost per tonne has stayed relatively the same at around £265 for the past 4 years. 

If I had to make the same choice now between a pellet boiler, an ashp, oil burner or gas I would go for an ashp. They where pretty close at the time 9 years ago it was just the fact I didn't know a single person here who had one I could quiz about them plus there was hardly any companies doing them so if any thing went wrong who could I get out to fix it.

They do work but like every single heating system if it's not sized correctly or installed correctly it won't work at it's most efficient.

[Gordo]

16 hours ago, Trw144 said:

I'm looking to put a pellet boiler with manual fill hopper on the side that will contain approximately 200kg (roughyly 1000kWh of energy) -  it isn't actually that space hungry. Running costs likely to be similar to an air source heat pump and as far as I see it, either way we're at the mercy of a fuel supplier.

Yeah that is what I went for 100kg daily hopper on side. A lot of the maintenance issues and troubles I heard of were with silos. Plus you can get a better handle on consumption. Can be a little bit of a pain in winter when you have to manually fill it every other day. As long as you can fork lift ton pallets close to the boiler it not a big deal.

 

I have had no significant issues but it is more involving that oil or gas. But I am a bit of a fiddler so it suits me well. But for the majority of people I would say it would not be for them.

[Gordo]

On 11/11/2021 at 05:30, SteamyTea said:

The general opinion on here, and predecessor website, is that pellet boiler were not worth the bother or expense.

And then there is the 'carbon neutral' miss accounting that makes gas no worse environmentally.

Not for everyone indeed. An they do have their hassle issues to resolve. Plus they aren’t that cheap, unless compared to other renewable heating systems. I think my boiler alone was about £3k which was a bargain. The boiler is modulating flame so no need for buffer tank if you manage it well in settings.

 

I do like the fact that the fuel i use is cut and processed relatively locally which keeps money and employment local and they promise to plant 3 trees for every tree cut (sounds good). They are theoretically carbon neutral however the other pollutants are an issue I wasn’t originally aware of ?. Still at least money is kept local rather than Arabia or Russia.

Edited November 12, 2021 by Gordo

[Gordo]

16 hours ago, Declan52 said:

For the past 5 years any repairs that where required I done them myself. Luckily enough they are used widespread in the rest of the EU so there is plenty of websites to help. Same goes with servicing. I strip it down once a year and clean it all out. 

In total I have replaced the burn pot twice and the air intake sensor twice. Approximately £300 costs for 7 years isn't that bad. 

 

We are lucky  that balcas have a factory here making wood pellets so I have easy access to fuel. The cost per tonne has stayed relatively the same at around £265 for the past 4 years. 

Mines is a boiler and i do servicing myself as well, which is easy enough as the are fundamentally crude enough. I’ve replaced computer twice (first blew straight away as that was the symptom rather than the cause of problem, which was a short), connection board twice both due to a short. I’ve never had to replace the burn pot yet as it is in good shape. Yours must be running  very hot or maybe lean? I do worry about keeping it going longer time as there is a lack of competent engineers.

 

I use only use Belcas as local at around £235 / tonne bagged. Don’t know why cheaper. And use 3-4 tonnes per year. Madness using imported pellets for minimal savings.

Edited November 12, 2021 by Gordo

[Gordo]

On 11/11/2021 at 09:46, Trw144 said:

 

Generally pellet quality is good in the UK if you stick with certified pellets, and ensure if it is a blown delivery then the pressures are kept sensible (distances kept to circa 15/20m max, and ensure the driver doesn't turn the pressures up so he can get home for his tea).

Only had one issue with hard wood pellets I tried from a furniture manufacturer. They were IMO to moist. I’d strongly advise against silo with bulk blower delivery for fuel. Best save a few grand and use bags. A friend of mines silo actually went on fire somehow and he abandoned system after. He had lots of problems with pellet quality and blockages.

[SteamyTea]

11 minutes ago, Gordo said:

I’d strongly advise against silo with bulk blower delivery for fuel

They have to be designed correctly as well.  There is a chance that CO₂ can accumulate to fatal levels.

[Declan52]

44 minutes ago, Gordo said:

Mines is a boiler and i do servicing myself as well, which is easy enough as the are fundamentally crude enough. I’ve replaced computer twice (first blew straight away as that was the symptom rather than the cause of problem, which was a short), connection board twice both due to a short. I’ve never had to replace the burn pot yet as it is in good shape. Yours must be running  very hot or maybe lean? I do worry about keeping it going longer time as there is a lack of competent engineers.

 

I use only use Belcas as local at around £235 / tonne bagged. Don’t know why cheaper. And use 3-4 tonnes per year. Madness using imported pellets for minimal savings.

The burn pot on mine is fairly small. Wouldn't hold more than a hand full of pellets. Due to the holes in the base to allow air flow in to sustain the burn this area is pretty thin so just burns through. Once this happens the pellets fall through and the burn isn't consistent. 

 

[SteamyTea]

2 hours ago, Gordo said:

they promise to plant 3 trees for every tree cut (sounds good

Have you seen how small 3 new trees are. A lot less than you burn in a year.

[Gordo]

1 hour ago, Declan52 said:

The burn pot on mine is fairly small. Wouldn't hold more than a hand full of pellets. Due to the holes in the base to allow air flow in to sustain the burn this area is pretty thin so just burns through. Once this happens the pellets fall through and the burn isn't consistent. 

 

Ah mine would hold about 1/2 kg and very thick walled steel

[Gordo]

1 minute ago, SteamyTea said:

Have you seen how small 3 new trees are. A lot less than you burn in a year.

Lol I know but from small acorns grow hugh oak trees (eventually). Need to think long term

[Gordo]

1 hour ago, SteamyTea said:

They have to be designed correctly as well.  There is a chance that CO₂ can accumulate to fatal levels.

Yes there is a HSE guidance on this very subject after two or three people died cleaning out their silo. When blowing the pellets into the silo if under excess pressure or if poorly designed silo discharge you can just end up with sawdust. Doesn’t burn too well.

[Trw144]

43 minutes ago, Gordo said:

Yes there is a HSE guidance on this very subject after two or three people died cleaning out their silo. When blowing the pellets into the silo if under excess pressure or if poorly designed silo discharge you can just end up with sawdust. Doesn’t burn too well.

Shouldn't be blown too far, or under too much pressure. The silo itself should have an anti-shatter mat to absorb the impact of the pellets being blown in.

[SteamyTea]

1 hour ago, Gordo said:

Lol I know but from small acorns grow hugh oak trees (eventually). Need to think long term

They are greenwashing. Cutting down a mature tree, that sequesters more carbon than saplings, especially if it is just replacement, rather than adding to the total area being wooded, is what is known as ecobollocks.

There was a company down here that fitted pellet boilers, their USP was that the timber came from their own land.

It now has 135 houses on it, part financed by the original RHI.

[Gordo]

On 12/11/2021 at 17:26, SteamyTea said:

They are greenwashing. Cutting down a mature tree, that sequesters more carbon than saplings, especially if it is just replacement, rather than adding to the total area being wooded, is what is known as ecobollocks.

There was a company down here that fitted pellet boilers, their USP was that the timber came from their own land.

It now has 135 houses on it, part financed by the original RHI.

Yeah well aware it open to abuse ?. Still in principal it carbon neutral or better over say 20 years not immediately obviously.
 

The trees are never going to be left alone to die and decompose (which releases the carbon into the atmosphere again when decomposed anyway). They need to be a relevant commodity if their numbers are to increase and we are to benefit locally from their presence on the landscape and air quality etc

 

I am a bit of a eco sceptic tbh but I have a tendency to want to hug the odd tree lol (don’t tell anyone). Main reasons I like it is local jobs for local people unlike oil and gas. Even PV panels and wind farms which are as far as I know all manufactured abroad. And I have a little faith in Belcas claims. Pretty confident the vast majority of their timbers is from home growen timbers and the bulk of it is waste product from their saw mills I see their lumber trucks all the time on way to mills with felled timber

Edited November 13, 2021 by Gordo