What’s happening with this thermal store?

[recoveringbuilder]

Bio Quattro 500l TS  running dhw, ufh and radiators. Wednesday night a couple of the radiators had cold spots at the bottom so we bled them. Overnight temperatures went to minus 10 and when we got up in the morning we had no water coming out of the taps other than the cold water tap in the kitchen, nothing could be done at that point as we’re both going to work. When I returned in the afternoon I tried the hot tap in the kitchen but still nothing so washed my hands under the cold tap. Once I turned it back off there was the sound of water coming in (same sound as we get usually after flushing a toilet) I then tried the hot tap again and after a few minutes got a trickle followed by a lot of spurting and then the hot water came through. Eventually after the same performance all the hot taps apart from one upstairs came through. Last night the ufh couldn’t reach above 17 degrees, hubby was intending to top up the underfloor system this weekend but before he does this thought I’d ask as it looks to me as if it’s all connected somehow. There is 4 bar pressure coming into the house but it appears it is not getting to the TS. We have no water , hot or cold, anywhere this morning other than the cold tap in the kitchen.

[dpmiller]

do you have an accumulator?

[recoveringbuilder]

1 minute ago, dpmiller said:

do you have an accumulator?

No

[ProDave]

Does your thermal store work with a heat exchanger and a pump, or is it a passive one that just has a hot water coil through the stored water?

 

But either way, no water coming out of the tap means no cold going in to push it through.

 

It sounds like a frozen pipe to me.  I would look very carefully at how the cold in gets to the tank and does it pass any areas that could freeze?

 

We have been down to -16 here,  and at this time of year the cold water in is about 3 degrees, it would not take much to freeze that,

[recoveringbuilder]

The EnergyStore Bio Quattro is designed for heating systems that incorporate biomass (log, pellet, or woodchip) and solar thermal. All EnergyStores at high spec and very well insulated. The Bio Quattro comes with tappings ideally located for pellet and wood boilers. An internal baffle plate eliminates convection currents, helping to maintain healthy layers of water at different temperatures = improved stratification. Two internal heat exchange coils provide mains-pressure domestic hot water at excellent flow rates.

[ProDave]

So it's not a pump issue it should be passive.  So I can't think what else it could be other than the cold feed to the tank had frozen.

[recoveringbuilder]

20 minutes ago, ProDave said:

So it's not a pump issue it should be passive.  So I can't think what else it could be other than the cold feed to the tank had frozen.

It looks like you’re right but issue getting air out between the kitchen sink and the thermal store 

[recoveringbuilder]

So we’ve spent the last few hours at this ? it appears the pipe is not frozen, whether it was at some point I don’t know but it isn’t now. The water is getting to the pipe that feeds the thermal store and this goes up over the kitchen (between the ceiling and upstairs  floor so inaccessible) but it never makes it to the TS , looks like it’s air locked but how on earth do we clear the airlock?

[ProDave]

Normally mains water will blow air locks out of the pipe, it's usually only a problem with low pressure heating systems.

[Declan52]

Turn on a shower low and cold and let it splurt away. If you use a tap on a basin when it spits out it goes everywhere.

[recoveringbuilder]

Just now, Declan52 said:

Turn on a shower low and cold and let it splurt away. If you use a tap on a basin when it spits out it goes everywhere.

There’s no water coming out of anything other than the cold tap at the kitchen sink 

[Declan52]

Nothing will come out until the water coming in pushes the air out. Run the kitchen one very low and then move around and try other taps/shower.

[recoveringbuilder]

Spent all day at this with no success, ended up phoning plumber at 3.45pm , he told us he has spent all day at frozen pipes! He thinks it will have been frozen and there’s probably a lump of ice somewhere that’s blocked the pipe. I find this hard to imagine as the pipes run above the kitchen ceiling and under the bedroom floor, they’re all insulated and are up there with 300mm of insulation too , the kitchen is always sitting above 20 degrees, he told us to ramp up the heat and see if it dissolve it but it’s going to be another cold one tonight so I can’t see it happening 

[ProDave]

I have a frozen vent pipe at our rental in an inaccessible loft space that has defied any attempts to defrost it.  I am awaiting tomorrows "heat wave" to see if it thaws it then see it there is a burst.

 

Don;t underestimate how cold it has been and for how long up here.

[recoveringbuilder]

14 hours ago, ProDave said:

I have a frozen vent pipe at our rental in an inaccessible loft space that has defied any attempts to defrost it.  I am awaiting tomorrows "heat wave" to see if it thaws it then see it there is a burst.

 

Don;t underestimate how cold it has been and for how long up here.

It’s back! Got up this morning to find all had been restored.

[ProDave]

Yep, the blockage has thawed,  and if there are no leaks you got away without it bursting.

[Chanmenie]

4 minutes ago, recoveringbuilder said:

It’s back! Got up this morning to find all had been restored.

So now you  need to find out where the pipe froze and sort preventative measures to stop it happening again 

[recoveringbuilder]

5 minutes ago, Chanmenie said:

So now you  need to find out where the pipe froze and sort preventative measures to stop it happening again 

Yip, problem being most of it is inaccessible!

[SteamyTea]

Wrap some self regulating tracing heating as close as you can to the problem area.