Tennentslager Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 (edited) The Morco caravan boiler (LPG with battery ignition---NO mains power on site) needs 1 bar of pressure. Plan A was to connect to the local main but for a hundred reasons this is difficult. However 20m from site there is a public stand pipe and it is okay to connect a hose to this but never permanently. No comments about *tapping* into this with a cheeky underground junction, that would be just plain wrong! *If* I use a hose to fill a header tank to feed the boiler, how high would it need to be to give me 1 bar. From what I can understand it's 10m. Plenty of big trees around but FFS that's a lot of work to have a hot shower. Edited February 8, 2017 by Tennentslager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Harris Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 (edited) Yes, roughly 10m head of water to 1 bar is a good enough approximation for this sort of calc. Edited February 8, 2017 by JSHarris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crofter Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 Yep, 1 bar = 33ft in old money. I wonder if you could organise a pumped feed instead? If the one bar is simply a minimum, and the heater doesn't require a very narrow pressure range, then a pump might be the easier option. If you are only allowed occasional connection to the stand pipe then a header tank sounds useful anyway though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Temp Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 Perhaps this sort of thing? The buffer tank stops the pump short cycling at low flow rates. https://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ecosure.co.uk%2Facatalog%2Fsupercomplete-pump.jpg&imgrefurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ecosure.co.uk%2Facatalog%2FEcosure_Rainwater_Harvesting_SuperComplete_2800.html&docid=ZDz-QrBKG6UwkM&tbnid=BoAAQyD5JrwBhM%3A&vet=1&w=350&h=500&client=tablet-android-pega&bih=600&biw=960&q=rainwater pump&ved=0ahUKEwjsnp2nt4HSAhVKDsAKHaQuB7EQMwh2KFEwUQ&iact=mrc&uact=8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tennentslager Posted February 8, 2017 Author Share Posted February 8, 2017 (edited) Thanks @Temp but that's pricey and any pump needs to use what little battery power I have. Dunno what force is in the standpipe but it fairly skooshes out lots on full whack...(hope that's not to offensive for the technically educated) so if I can get a container up a tree...I guess a hose could be used to charge it up. But what could be lashed to a giant fir tree 10m up and what size for a couple of showers and some dishwashing of a weekend? Edited February 8, 2017 by Tennentslager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 I fear you may have bought the "wrong" caravan heater. That's probably meant for a static 'van with mains water connection. You would be better off with a touring caravan unit. They tend to be storage heaters rather than instant heaters. All then need is a cold water container and a small 12V pump. Pump cold water in and it pushes the hot water out of the top. And the little 12V caravan pumps can manage to pump water from these to give a just about acceptable shower. Chances ar you could get one cheap or even free from a rotted out old touring 'van. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crofter Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 I'm going to presume that a caravan water heater is not going to have a tremendous output so you'll probably want to limit the flow rate in order to keep the temperature up. Does it have a kW rating? I know from personal experience that you can just about shower in five litres (one of those solar bag thingies) but it's not the best experience ever! As an absolute minimum a shower at home would be using 5l/min so say 20-30l per shower as an absolute lowest figure. So you're looking at about a 100l container to give a couple of showers and a bit left over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 In our touring 'van the "limit" is about 25 litres of water for a shower. The trick is to turn the little storage water heater up to maximum (almost scalding hot) then dilute with plenty of cold, then you can have an acceptable shower before the hot water runs out (the limit being when the cold water tank runs dry) The Morco heater I am pretty sure is what we have in the static 'van and it's powerful enough to heat water instantly for a shower. They do use a lot of gas while running so tend to like the larger gas bottles. Here's the sort of caravan heater I am talking about http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/caravan-water-heater-/172511488144?hash=item282a7c6890:g:KU8AAOSwnHZYknjQ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tennentslager Posted February 8, 2017 Author Share Posted February 8, 2017 This is the one I'm thinking of... http://www.morcoproducts.co.uk/stock-5-6/Water_Heaters/G11E.html 11 litres per minute at plus 25℃ but around £500 excluding fitting! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 Yes that's meant for a static van with mains water. Have a serious look at the touring van storage water heaters that will work just from a 12V pump. For example https://www.truma.com/uk/en/water-systems/gas-electric-boiler.php Similar cost new the the Morco, but much better suited to your hut. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteamyTea Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 8 hours ago, Tennentslager said: No comments about *tapping* into this with a cheeky underground junction, that would be just plain wrong! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 What water system / plumbing do you have so far? You've got a wash hand basin and kitchen sink, they plumbed in already? Do you have attic / high up space for a coffin tank ( storage tank with fitted lid etc ). ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tennentslager Posted February 9, 2017 Author Share Posted February 9, 2017 24 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said: What water system / plumbing do you have so far? You've got a wash hand basin and kitchen sink, they plumbed in already? Do you have attic / high up space for a coffin tank ( storage tank with fitted lid etc ). ? Wash basin and sink are dry fitted ATM. I've enough space above toilet for a tank but about 2m the floor. Probably 1.5m above the taps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 What's the crack with the upstand? Is it just a communal,'outside tap' ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tennentslager Posted February 9, 2017 Author Share Posted February 9, 2017 2 hours ago, Nickfromwales said: What's the crack with the upstand? Is it just a communal,'outside tap' ? Yup, stand pipe in a wooden housing with a tap that has threaded end to take a hose fitting. You can see the plastic pipe that feeds it and someone has teed off this rather obviously to blag his own water supply. Clearly against all regs, probably the law too and pretty easy to follow the trail to him so he will get caught eventually. At present we use 5l water bottles and fill from the tap, usually 4 at a time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Harris Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 Just an off-the-wall idea, but if you can get a decent hose to the standpipe, how about installing an accumulator to store water in the hut, under pressure? It takes up space, but could be put outside in an insulated box. If filled via a NRV on the accumulator, via a removable pressure hose that fits the standpipe, you could have water at the same pressure as at the tap, with no pump. Fit a pressure gauge and you have early warning that the tank is getting low and needs topping up. You could then have ordinary plumbing in the hut if you wanted to. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 That would need sufficient pressure at the upstand. Any chance of getting a reading? Late evening is best when the local network is under less demand. If one person has teed off the upstand, does anyone actually care as long as it's not getting abused? If they were watering the garden all day then that's one thing, but an occasional hand wash or 5 min shower isn't going to have anyone in tears is it? How many people share the upstand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tennentslager Posted February 9, 2017 Author Share Posted February 9, 2017 I'm leaning towards a coffin tank for cold to the kitchen sink and wash hand basin. Fill this from a hose and fit an overflow in case of forgetfulness? For the winter months I can drain this down before heading home for freeze protection...sound sensible? The big 8 pint kettle on the stove works well just now...mix with some cold and it's perfectly comfortable. I suppose the Hut is a holiday place and there's never a hurry to get up and out to work. Morning routine is pretty relaxed so no bother if the water takes a while to heat. If in a hurry the gas stove boils a kettle in 5 minutes. Might be best to stay low tech for now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crofter Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 A lot of boaty people swear by those pump action weedkiller sprayers, apparently they make quite good showers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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