Hello! New build/adventure ahead... At design stage

[mjward]

Hello lovely helpful people!

 

Quick intro: my name is Martin and we are a family of 4 finally attempting to realise a long term dream of escaping to the country (from London). 

 

I retired this year so have all the time in the world to fantasize and research and then eventually get my hands dirty. Plan is for builders to turnover a shell build and I will do as much of the rest as I can (will leave boiler and fusebox to the professionals!)

 

The last few weeks I've ramped up the research and even drawn up a few different floor plans. Roughly speaking I'm looking to build a classic red brick rectangular property of approximately 400 SQM. Grand designs this won't be?

 

Now for some early questions if I may?

 

1) I've seen a range of £1500-3000/SQM mentioned for a self build guide. Approximately what % of that range is the structure itself?

2) For those taking on the labour of electrics, carpentry, plastering, plumbing etc where did you end up on a per SQM cost for your build?

3) another one for those that did various trades, were they any obvious ones you regret starting and wish you had paid labour for?

4) is my assumption that it's harder to get planning permission for larger houses correct? I had originally designed the house over 4 storeys (Inc basement and loft) as thought smaller footprint would help but after scaring myself with basement damp/leak stories I've managed to redesign it across standard 2 storeys. Please find floor plan below 

 

Thanks in advance and look forward to being a fully engaged member of this forum moving forward ?

[nod]

Welcome 

 

I brought five Brickies in to build the shell

I did the roof and slating to get it watertight 

and pretty much most of the rest between my wife and myself 

283 m2 Came in at 830m2 

Pretty good standard fit out 

German kitchen and three bathrooms 

Italian tiles throughout 

Sash windows 

400 m2 of paving 

 

We are just in the process of completing the purchase of two more plots 

I would be very disappointed if we don’t complete the build for under a £1000 m2 

[Bozza]

Hello Martin & welcome.  My turnkey house is costing circa £1200-£1300 sqm. 214 sqm.  NE Scotland. Medium-high spec. Family of 3 with a 10 year old. Also recently retired.
 

Is the idea of doing the work yourself motivated by budget or by wanting to keep busy/project.  And also can I ask age of kids/ is spouse retired.  All relevant to advice I can offer from my own experience.  
 

Bozza

[mjward]

2 hours ago, nod said:

Welcome 

 

I brought five Brickies in to build the shell

I did the roof and slating to get it watertight 

and pretty much most of the rest between my wife and myself 

283 m2 Came in at 830m2 

Pretty good standard fit out 

German kitchen and three bathrooms 

Italian tiles throughout 

Sash windows 

400 m2 of paving 

 

We are just in the process of completing the purchase of two more plots 

I would be very disappointed if we don’t complete the build for under a £1000 m2 

That's a phenomenal cost and brings me a bit more confidence/relief. Any features you look back on and think so glad you did that? And importantly any regrets/things you would avoid?

[mjward]

48 minutes ago, Bozza said:

Hello Martin & welcome.  My turnkey house is costing circa £1200-£1300 sqm. 214 sqm.  NE Scotland. Medium-high spec. Family of 3 with a 10 year old. Also recently retired.
 

Is the idea of doing the work yourself motivated by budget or by wanting to keep busy/project.  And also can I ask age of kids/ is spouse retired.  All relevant to advice I can offer from my own experience.  
 

Bozza

Gorgeous house and great build cost as well!

 

Hate to sit on the fence but it's a bit of both, I love keeping busy and learn new things so I want to get involved for that aspect but also as I think carpentry might be a business I'd enjoy (from a furniture aspect) so think doing loads of bits in the house would be a great learning environment. But there is also the cost part, the more I can save the more I have as a retirement cash buffer.

 

Wife still works but from home and although retired from my main career I wouldn't rule out me finding a work from home job down the line. Kids have few years between them, son is 16 ie will be 18 when build complete so whether he lives with us depends if we get plot within commute of whatever uni he goes to. Daughter is 10 so we can count on her for foreseeable future.

 

A final aspect (on the keeping busy front)... If on the off chance the whole experience is borderline enjoyable and we actually create a thing of value (commensurate with the stress), I also wouldn't rule out selling the final article and going again! (If my wife doesn't kill me first)

[Bozza]

Ok so you have to give some thought to the fact that if you are doing a lot of the work yourself and you,’re not a tradesman the build will take longer and the family will be living in a building site / caravan for some time.  You might therefore want to think about renting but by the time you add that in you might be worth going more towards a more turnkey service.    Your proposed house is huge and it won’t be long before you and wife are living in a very large house when the kids are away.  Less of an issue if you intend to sell when the kids leave home.

 

An option for you could be to build a smaller house with less personal involvement.  So you all get to move in quicker, perhaps you could do the kitchen something like that, perhaps provide help to the trades.  And that’s you in a nice house in the country.  Then move to phase 2, with your increased knowledge, and build a big double garage with accommodation above. Something you can do yourself more hands on.  So you have the smallest commute between home in country and your project. 

 

I was like you wanted to get hands on and save money but wife persuaded us to go turnkey but I’m doing the kitchen.  Then landscaping and the most luxurious manshed known to, well, man.  House is big enough for us as a family, small enough that when daughter leaves home we won’t need to sell because it’s too big.
 

you’ll have seen those self build TV shows where the fella ends up working 16 hours a day for 3 years and misses his family growing up.  But it’s broadcast in a 55min show.  Also think god forbid if you got injured or ill mid build.

Edited August 19, 2020 by Bozza

[mjward]

All very fair points. With regards to accomodation we are fortunate to have two properties in London where the family can stay so this would be me solo in a caravan Monday to Friday for a year until it's in a livable as opposed to finished state. I've just finished a 5yr expat stint so we have become accustomed to times apart and we make it work.

 

We are a very social family and so even when the kids are out it wouldn't be uncommon for us to have guess staying at least once a fortnight so hopefully it's not an empty cave we call our home ?

 

With regards to your kitchen work, I'm intrigued as I proclaimed to my wife only this week that I could do it. I mean I've watched 3 hours of YouTube videos so believe I'm qualified! Are you installing pre made carcasses or doing whole thing yourself?

[nod]

31 minutes ago, mjward said:

That's a phenomenal cost and brings me a bit more confidence/relief. Any features you look back on and think so glad you did that? And importantly any regrets/things you would avoid?

Quicker hot water tap 

My wife thought I was being extravagant spending a £1000 on a tap 

while I’m happy that we purchased Grohe and Gebrits for the bathrooms 

The free standing extremely heavy tub looks amazing 

But we’ve never used it 

Same with two of the showers 
While we have UFH my wife insisted on a wood burner 

3k well spent 

One big spend was importing 175 m2 of Italian Porcelain slats 

Pretty happy with those and great to lay 

My wife’s indulgence was a German kitchen with quarts surfaces 

While I saved quite a bit fitting it myself I’m not convinced that they are worth all the extra cost 

and 7k on appliances was more than I would have spent 

We could have got below 800m2

[mjward]

We have very similar tastes! Our current properties have the quooker hot taps and geberits but my big regret was not getting Grohe, will eventually replace everything with it.

 

Wet UFH was also a win in kitchen and bathrooms although I regret the electric UFH in ensuite, isn't the same. Would love a wood burner but in new build I'm going for ultra energy saving to keep utility bills down and that means no heat escaping where it shouldn't ??‍♂️

 

Also totally agree on kitchen. Across the intoto units, silestone worktops, quartz crystal flooring, Miele and liebherr appliances we spent £70k on one kitchen. Yet every time I walk around IKEA I see the doppelganger for £4k!!

 

[recoveringbuilder]

Welcome! The problem with diy is; it’s a lonely job, everything takes much longer than you think it’s going to and you end up getting fed up with it. The house we built before this current one was 385m2  and really much too large for a couple with a grown up son , we had a studio flat above the integrated garage for son so the two of us rattled about it for 8 years before finally deciding to sell. My hubby (and myself) and son in law worked every spare minute they had ( as well as working full time) for 18 months. We had a couple of joiners and a couple of brickies and an electrician and everything else was self built, we spent New Year’s Eve laying underfloor heating pipes and spent 2 winters in a caravan. Would we go this way again? Never! We built the current house with builders although we did do a lot of incidental work and sourcing of materials and not everything went smoothly but we managed to get out of the caravan and into the house within 6 months (although we’re still doing garage and drive on our own and it’s been done to quite a high spec for£1k per metre.

[mjward]

4 minutes ago, Christine Walker said:

Welcome! The problem with diy is; it’s a lonely job, everything takes much longer than you think it’s going to and you end up getting fed up with it. The house we built before this current one was 385m2  and really much too large for a couple with a grown up son , we had a studio flat above the integrated garage for son so the two of us rattled about it for 8 years before finally deciding to sell. My hubby (and myself) and son in law worked every spare minute they had ( as well as working full time) for 18 months. We had a couple of joiners and a couple of brickies and an electrician and everything else was self built, we spent New Year’s Eve laying underfloor heating pipes and spent 2 winters in a caravan. Would we go this way again? Never! We built the current house with builders although we did do a lot of incidental work and sourcing of materials and not everything went smoothly but we managed to get out of the caravan and into the house within 6 months (although we’re still doing garage and drive on our own and it’s been done to quite a high spec for£1k per metre.

Hi Christine

I totally hear you. I should have lead with the fact I've done renovations before but not self builds. However, once you've taken a Victorian back to brick I don't think you're a million miles away from the work of a new build ??‍♂️ 

 

With regards to your current place, when you say incidentals what do you mean as £1k per SQM is a great price ???

[Bozza]

12 minutes ago, mjward said:

All very fair points. With regards to accomodation we are fortunate to have two properties in London where the family can stay so this would be me solo in a caravan Monday to Friday for a year until it's in a livable as opposed to finished state. I've just finished a 5yr expat stint so we have become accustomed to times apart and we make it work.

 

We are a very social family and so even when the kids are out it wouldn't be uncommon for us to have guess staying at least once a fortnight so hopefully it's not an empty cave we call our home ?

 

With regards to your kitchen work, I'm intrigued as I proclaimed to my wife only this week that I could do it. I mean I've watched 3 hours of YouTube videos so believe I'm qualified! Are you installing pre made carcasses or doing whole thing yourself?

Sure understood.  Re kitchens you’ll read a lot here about a company called DIY Kitchens.  Have a read of the posts.  I swear by them.  Yes they come rigid fit with metalwork & doors attracted. Easy peasy,  worktops are harder get someone to do them for you.  If you take your time & have the right tools kitchens Can be installed by the Self builder very easily.  Plenty of YouTube videos. The one advantage of self building is you can ensure your layout means simple installation of kitchen eg no weird angles etc.  Doing a run of tall units plus an island as commonly seen is a doddle.

 

[ToughButterCup]

1 hour ago, nod said:

.... 

My wife thought I was being extravagant spending a £1000 on a tap

.... 

 

Sensible woman. 

 

@mjward, what Gary ( @nod) is too modest to mention is that he is a very experienced, professional builder.

So what if his spell check has a sense of humour? I keep hoping he might find a plot near us so I can go round and pick his brains. Mind you he gets up at 5. Even at Christmas ?

[recoveringbuilder]

2 hours ago, mjward said:

Hi Christine

I totally hear you. I should have lead with the fact I've done renovations before but not self builds. However, once you've taken a Victorian back to brick I don't think you're a million miles away from the work of a new build ??‍♂️ 

 

With regards to your current place, when you say incidentals what do you mean as £1k per SQM is a great price ???

We did all the drainage and treatment plant installation, dug trenches for and laid water pipes, painting and decorating and generally keeping the site tidy. Tiling and wooden floors were laid at reduced rates by guys we’d used previously, biggest savings were really made with us sourcing all materials.We’d has a turnkey price previous to starting and it was £100k more than we spent and not to such high spec.

[mjward]

2 hours ago, Bozza said:

Sure understood.  Re kitchens you’ll read a lot here about a company called DIY Kitchens.  Have a read of the posts.  I swear by them.  Yes they come rigid fit with metalwork & doors attracted. Easy peasy,  worktops are harder get someone to do them for you.  If you take your time & have the right tools kitchens Can be installed by the Self builder very easily.  Plenty of YouTube videos. The one advantage of self building is you can ensure your layout means simple installation of kitchen eg no weird angles etc.  Doing a run of tall units plus an island as commonly seen is a doddle.

 

Good tip thank you! And on that note, that's stage 2 of my research... standard sizes. A potential unobtainable fantasy but I was thinking if I could design a house with dimensions that's reflected standard plasterboard, floor tiles, kitchen cabinets... Would save a lot of time!

[mjward]

1 hour ago, ToughButterCup said:

Sensible woman. 

 

@mjward, what Gary ( @nod) is too modest to mention is that he is a very experienced, professional builder.

So what if his spell check has a sense of humour? I keep hoping he might find a plot near us so I can go round and pick his brains. Mind you he gets up at 5. Even at Christmas ?

Nowt wrong with an early bird... Despite being retired I can't break the bad habit of waking between 5-6 myself.. sadly means I'm fast asleep by 9pm most nights ??

[mjward]

2 minutes ago, Christine Walker said:

We did all the drainage and treatment plant installation, dug trenches for and laid water pipes, painting and decorating and generally keeping the site tidy. Tiling and wooden floors were laid at reduced rates by guys we’d used previously, biggest savings were really made with us sourcing all materials.We’d has a turnkey price previous to starting and it was £100k more than we spent and not to such high spec.

What a phenomenal saving. Not stress free I bet but when the money saved gets to that magnitude...well worth it 

[AliG]

Welcome,

 

As people have said you can probably save a lot doing all the work yourself. Many people are coming in the £1500-2000 a square metre range when using a main contractor and high end finishes and insulation. More modest tastes can probably get you in the £12-1300 range and doing as much work as you suggest yourself could well get that down to £1000 a square metre.

 

I really would caution you on the time it will take you though. That is a large house. If you got a builder to do it I would expect them to take over 6 months after the shell was finished. Doing a lot of the work yourself could easily take two years. On a personal note, I am going to retire next year after working away for 18 years. I very much look forward to spending time with my family. The kids will be grown up and away soon enough.

 

I would avoid a basement unless it is the only way to get the floorspace that you need as they are expensive to build. If you can get the same size of house on the plot above ground then do that. Using the roof space on the other hand is cheaper space if you want a larger house, a nice alternative is high ceilings upstairs in some spaces.

 

At the moment, I would just plan and plan and plan. How all you use rooms, who will be there, where will the furniture be, what way does the window face? You can always redecorate etc, but once the fabric of the house is built you are pretty much stuck with it, so that is the key thing to worry about.

 

You have a nice spacious footprint which is good, but I think you need to work on the layout. Overall the man issue is that the allocation of space between rooms seems odd with bathrooms larger than bedrooms and 2 rooms that are only 3x3m then 2 that are 2x3m

 

Downstairs -

 

1. We wanted a grand stair which it looks like you have gone for too, but it is too close to the front door. It will make the hall feel cramped despite being large.

2. Study seems about right, but the snug/tv room which would expect to have more people in it is too small. We have a cinema room and everyone just ends up in there watching the TV on the big screen anyway, so I would worry it wouldn't be used.

3. Is that a pantry or utility room? Fine for a utility, too large for a pantry. We considered a pantry but it didn't fit neatly into the floorplan. Now when I consider that all the food in the house fits in the fridge, freezer and two cupboards in the kitchen I think a pantry would just lead to storing lots of stuff we don't use.

4. The kitchen is too narrow. You would struggle to get a sofa in there next to the table and feel comfortable. Keeping circulation room around furniture is important to have a feeling of space.

5. The gym is too small. We have been using a larger room (4.3x3.5) than this since lockdown and find it too small. What we have though is french doors in the room, so we often exercise between inside and outside which works really well. I would want access to the garden from a gym.

 

What I would do is combine the snug and library into one room like a very formal lounge/library. Then I would make the kitchen lager so it has a proper sitting area using space from the pantry.I wonder if you designed the house from the outside in. For our house I gave the architect a list of rooms that we wanted and the rough sizes then he designed the house around them.

 

6. 5.2m is not deep enough for a garage, I made this mistake on my last house. Plenty of large cars are around 5m long. You would barely be able to get it into the garage and not be able to get past it. I reckon you need at least 6m and ideally closer to 7m if you can. As the garage is 10m across I would probably put the car area at one end or the other rather than in the middle. I would also consider putting the utilities in the garage to have more space the house.

 

Upstairs, that hall will be really nice, we also have an upstairs laundry, it is great.

1. Especially as you say you may sell you really need to have en suites.

2. I would reduce the size of the bathrooms and add in ensuites, maybe losing one of the small rooms.

 

I think this is enough detail for now. I suspect you could go back and redo the plan once you hear people's input.

 

[AliG]

11 minutes ago, mjward said:

Good tip thank you! And on that note, that's stage 2 of my research... standard sizes. A potential unobtainable fantasy but I was thinking if I could design a house with dimensions that's reflected standard plasterboard, floor tiles, kitchen cabinets... Would save a lot of time!

 

I  thought this too but wouldn't worry about it too much. Certainly avoid very bespoke things like 2.2m doors or 2.8m ceilings if you want to save money, but built dimensions are unlikely to be exact enough and a lot of fittings as well as tiles actually benefit from not fitting exactly, eg framing around kitchen cupboards and tiles are usually laid with a grout line in the centre of a room and cut at the sides.

[mjward]

5 minutes ago, AliG said:

Welcome,

 

As people have said you can probably save a lot doing all the work yourself. Many people are coming in the £1500-2000 a square metre range when using a main contractor and high end finishes and insulation. More modest tastes can probably get you in the £12-1300 range and doing as much work as you suggest yourself could well get that down to £1000 a square metre.

 

I really would caution you on the time it will take you though. That is a large house. If you got a builder to do it I would expect them to take over 6 months after the shell was finished. Doing a lot of the work yourself could easily take two years. On a personal note, I am going to retire next year after working away for 18 years. I very much look forward to spending time with my family. The kids will be grown up and away soon enough.

 

I would avoid a basement unless it is the only way to get the floorspace that you need as they are expensive to build. If you can get the same size of house on the plot above ground then do that. Using the roof space on the other hand is cheaper space if you want a larger house, a nice alternative is high ceilings upstairs in some spaces.

 

At the moment, I would just plan and plan and plan. How all you use rooms, who will be there, where will the furniture be, what way does the window face? You can always redecorate etc, but once the fabric of the house is built you are pretty much stuck with it, so that is the key thing to worry about.

 

You have a nice spacious footprint which is good, but I think you need to work on the layout. Overall the man issue is that the allocation of space between rooms seems odd with bathrooms larger than bedrooms and 2 rooms that are only 3x3m then 2 that are 2x3m

 

Downstairs -

 

1. We wanted a grand stair which it looks like you have gone for too, but it is too close to the front door. It will make the hall feel cramped despite being large.

2. Study seems about right, but the snug/tv room which would expect to have more people in it is too small. We have a cinema room and everyone just ends up in there watching the TV on the big screen anyway, so I would worry it wouldn't be used.

3. Is that a pantry or utility room? Fine for a utility, too large for a pantry. We considered a pantry but it didn't fit neatly into the floorplan. Now when I consider that all the food in the house fits in the fridge, freezer and two cupboards in the kitchen I think a pantry would just lead to storing lots of stuff we don't use.

4. The kitchen is too narrow. You would struggle to get a sofa in there next to the table and feel comfortable. Keeping circulation room around furniture is important to have a feeling of space.

5. The gym is too small. We have been using a larger room (4.3x3.5) than this since lockdown and find it too small. What we have though is french doors in the room, so we often exercise between inside and outside which works really well. I would want access to the garden from a gym.

 

What I would do is combine the snug and library into one room like a very formal lounge/library. Then I would make the kitchen lager so it has a proper sitting area using space from the pantry.I wonder if you designed the house from the outside in. For our house I gave the architect a list of rooms that we wanted and the rough sizes then he designed the house around them.

 

6. 5.2m is not deep enough for a garage, I made this mistake on my last house. Plenty of large cars are around 5m long. You would barely be able to get it into the garage and not be able to get past it. I reckon you need at least 6m and ideally closer to 7m if you can. As the garage is 10m across I would probably put the car area at one end or the other rather than in the middle. I would also consider putting the utilities in the garage to have more space the house.

 

Upstairs, that hall will be really nice, we also have an upstairs laundry, it is great.

1. Especially as you say you may sell you really need to have en suites.

2. I would reduce the size of the bathrooms and add in ensuites, maybe losing one of the small rooms.

 

I think this is enough detail for now. I suspect you could go back and redo the plan once you hear people's input.

 

Firstly, I truly appreciate the time you've taken for such an extensive response. Genuinely that means a lot.

 

Will try and address the points made but apologies if I miss any.

 

1) the per SQM costs are fantastic. I'm definitely not looking for high end. Have done that twice for renovation and all it means is high end maintenance ??‍♂️??‍♂️??‍♂️

 

2) from a time perspective I am budgeting 2 years for it to be "done". Which is ambiguous I know. I suspect from planning permission it's around 1yr for me to be on site. 

 

3) agree on basement. No idea what plot we will get at this stage so potentially unavoidable but if I get enough land and planning permission works, I'm definitely erring towards larger ground/1st floor footage to lower costs 

 

4) I definitely need to work on room allocation. You are right in that we wanted a full height/grand staircase but also wanted space underneath it for movement so I suspect I will need to find a compromise there.

 

5) 100% spot on re snug usage, I live in my current cinema room and my wife on the open plan kitchen diner for her TV viewing. The small snug I don't anticipate getting much usage but want room optionality down the line 

 

6) I've catered for separate utility and pantry. Just off from the kitchen is a pantry which will house dry goods, kitchen appliances and a secondary fridge or freezer. Intend to keep most kitchen items in the kitchen itself.

 

7) agree on sofa/table space in kitchen area. Need to find at least an extra 1m of walkway 

 

?? my gym needs for many years have been a bike and a rower but you're right in that I need to be conscious about a potential resale and find room for a treadmill and maybe something else

 

9) snug/library combo is an excellent idea

 

10) the ensuite will be something I need to give further thought to. It's one of those "am I building for me" or to sell issues that warrants proper thought

[Bozza]

If you haven’t found a plot yet I wouldn’t spend to much on your design/layout beyond just messing about.  That was my mistake.  When I found a suitable plot (with house on it to be demo’d) I had real difficulties doing my design.  I then realised because I’d spent so long thinking about my perfect design it had influenced my creative juices.  I had to teach myself to forget my old designs and start afresh.  My plot was funny shaped and had great views which my design needed to take advantage of.  Also the style you would love to build may not be acceptable by planners in certain areas.  You’re better off having a wish list accommodation wise and assembling a portfolio of house styles You do like (Pinterest etc) for when you find your plot.  Then the fun starts !

[the_r_sole]

13 minutes ago, Bozza said:

If you haven’t found a plot yet I wouldn’t spend to much on your design/layout beyond just messing about.  That was my mistake.  When I found a suitable plot (with house on it to be demo’d) I had real difficulties doing my design.  I then realised because I’d spent so long thinking about my perfect design it had influenced my creative juices.  I had to teach myself to forget my old designs and start afresh.  My plot was funny shaped and had great views which my design needed to take advantage of.  Also the style you would love to build may not be acceptable by planners in certain areas.  You’re better off having a wish list accommodation wise and assembling a portfolio of house styles You do like (Pinterest etc) for when you find your plot.  Then the fun starts !

 

This is solid advice - the plot should be the most important bit of the puzzle, find the best plot you can and then sort out the house design which really makes the most out of the plot - in terms of the design, what you can do is try to work out what spaces you want, and the relationship between them all - also work out your priorities in terms of the must haves and the nice to haves, as there may be a tough budget discussion to be had at some point...

[mjward]

10 hours ago, Bozza said:

If you haven’t found a plot yet I wouldn’t spend to much on your design/layout beyond just messing about.  That was my mistake.  When I found a suitable plot (with house on it to be demo’d) I had real difficulties doing my design.  I then realised because I’d spent so long thinking about my perfect design it had influenced my creative juices.  I had to teach myself to forget my old designs and start afresh.  My plot was funny shaped and had great views which my design needed to take advantage of.  Also the style you would love to build may not be acceptable by planners in certain areas.  You’re better off having a wish list accommodation wise and assembling a portfolio of house styles You do like (Pinterest etc) for when you find your plot.  Then the fun starts !

In full agreement. At this stage the design stage is more to get an idea of what I would want in the house so I can determine property size and therefore minimum plot size. On the plot front I will continue looking but I'm hoping the govt change in October that forces councils to tag areas as growth will be a game changer for plot potential. 

[Bozza]

Martin, when it does come to designing your house also don’t forget about multifunctionality.  Take my house in earlier reply.  The triple upstairs window on the main larch elevation has the best view in the house.  My ten year old is getting that as when she has friends around & when she’s a teenager she’ll  be in her Bedroom during daylight hours more than me and Mrs.  We have a separate TV room downstairs at the back of the house.  When my daughter eventually leaves home the TV room will become a bedroom (it’s next to a downstairs cloakroom with a future shower).  And her bedroom, with a view, becomes an upstairs snug or whatever for us to enjoy.

 

We've configured our house with three decent bedrooms upstairs - one a spare.  But if we did sell, the downstairs TV room & study, both off a small hallway at back of house, become bedrooms.  So we’ve built a big 3 bedroom house for our needs but a 5 bedroom one if we ever do sell it.
 

box clever mate.

 

 

[Ferdinand]

12 hours ago, Bozza said:

If you haven’t found a plot yet I wouldn’t spend to much on your design/layout beyond just messing about.  That was my mistake.  When I found a suitable plot (with house on it to be demo’d) I had real difficulties doing my design.  I then realised because I’d spent so long thinking about my perfect design it had influenced my creative juices.  I had to teach myself to forget my old designs and start afresh.  My plot was funny shaped and had great views which my design needed to take advantage of.  Also the style you would love to build may not be acceptable by planners in certain areas.  You’re better off having a wish list accommodation wise and assembling a portfolio of house styles You do like (Pinterest etc) for when you find your plot.  Then the fun starts !

 

I think that is interesting - what @Bozza has been able to do is the extensive learning process that all self-builders need to develop a (limited - architects have 7 years) subset / appreciation of certain parts of the architect skillset, and then to generalise it to a different plot.

 

Spending open-minded time up front can help a lot of self-builders get a better, less 'play school' house for the same or less money. A lot do that, but some don't.

 

The same applies to living in it as life changes.

 

Ferdinand

 

 

Edited August 20, 2020 by Ferdinand