MikeGrahamT21

Been thinking about different finishes for the vaulted ceiling in our new extension, and I've come up with the idea of timber cladding with gaps in between (a bit like what people use on the outside of buildings), think it will look nice in there, and a little different from the usual plaster. Obviously the roof trusses are timber, and the insulation is PIR with foil face. Question is, do I need to have any sort of fire retardant barrier behind the timber cladding on a ceiling? I've seen some on the web for about £100 a roll. I'd ask building control, but I doubt they would understand the concept of not using plasterboard lol

I will indeed, thanks for your input as always. Will do!

Yeah I agree mate! I'd rather pay the extra for solid brass. Well, I think my plan is set. Just need my wife to get better now, so I can knock through into the extension and then start all of this work, so it may not happen this year, but hopefully it will, as that means shes better!

The ones I've chosen are solid brass stems with chrome coating on them, and a pushfit connector, a little more expensive but should look nicer overall, then I'll put some chrome pipe cover on the little section of copper which will be showing, or paint it with some kind of chrome paint, I'll make sure it looks good either way :-) Infact, I've even found a white one: https://www.plumbnation.co.uk/site/hep2o-spigot-elbows/ but they are plastic, i'd rather the brass one for the compression as you say

it would be good to know a realistic ball park figure without having to get a company out to do a full quote. Our main issue with a dormer though is lack of space to put stairs, we could make it work but it would be hard work, we don't have a massive amount of square meterage, though lots of houses on the estate have dormers, its often in the slightly larger version of our house, not always, but most of the time. We would have to lose the 2nd bedroom for the staircase, so would need at least 2 bedrooms upstairs, gaining us 1 extra overall, ideally we'd get 2 bedrooms and 1 shower room upstairs if we went that way. I'm up for considering anything, my main concern with dormer is whether the planning department would allow flat roof mounted solar panels, if they won't, then we are limited to a single dormer, and would have to move 8 solar panels on to the utility roof (i designed it to take these anyway, plus its south facing)

no no, it was just a wild guess, based upon odd things i've read in Magazines. I know the materials aren't that much, its the labour. House is a 2bed semi bungalow, what do you reckon rough price? This would be for a full dormer conversion, double preferably, GRP roof, with 8x mounting for solar panels (if allowed by LA), probably 4x triple glazed windows, and cedar cladding to the outside.

Yeah I totally get it, i've looked into EWI for the whole house as it stands now, and the amount it costs is crazy compared to what we would save. I did the EWI myself on an extension i built, it was straight forward enough, but really hard work, and still cost a lot of money, but less than what it would have done. Yeah I thought about it, but I don't think the savings would be enough to justify it, plus it would be nice to have extra garden! :-) I read that planning wasn't required for 2 in to 1, but was for 1 into 2, but i have no firm answer on that. OK, EPC is quite cheap i guess so thats no problems. Another thing i've just thought about, we have solar panels with FiT, would any of this affect that?

Ah right, so its not set in stone that it is required then. Its certainly possible in these houses, but it is more ££, and if we have to buy cash, there won't be a lot of ££ left to do things like expensive EWI.

Originally we were thinking about adding a dormer conversion to our 2 bed bungalow (double if possible), which probably wouldn't be practical for us for a number of reasons, until I had the thought of buying the house which is attached to ours when it became available, I've known the people who live there all my life, and a couple of years ago when i was building an extension on the back of ours, the lady said she'd ask her Son to sell it us cheap so we can knock through into it, and I never thought any more of it really, until last year. Recently the lady has passed away, leaving her husband who is in his 70's, so I want to be as ready as I can be to buy as and when it becomes available, which may well not be for a very long time, but could also be soon, you just never know, we hadn't expected her passing away last year. House will probably be around the 100k mark, going on the state of it (poor) and other house sale prices in area. I reckon a dormer on ours would set us back at least 40k all done, which is what made me thinking about putting that 40k to better use, and gaining far more. Am I right in thinking that we wouldn't be able to get a mortgage on the house next door due to our plans? I've also read that you just can't buy an adjoining property with a mortgage? Now as I believe it, no planning is involved making 2 houses into 1, building control is required for the structural conversion as would be expected. Because of the major renovation, would we have to upgrade both houses to modern standards of insulation? This is something we want to do anyway for obvious reasons, but want to factor it into the price, as insulation prices aren't going to be going down any time soon, and to get it to modern standards would require external wall insulation. Any ideas/input from anyone who has perhaps done this themselves in the past would be brill :-) Until the time comes, we'll just keep saving, we aren't big spenders anyway!

Forget the female elbows, I'm going to use the push fit stem elbows, a small section of copper, then a 15-16 converter hidden behind the rad, job done!

Think i'll buy a cheap 15mm female elbow, i've got a spare TRV in the garage, and I'll have a mess with it to see where it lands. Obviously I can't test for leaks, but it should give me an idea if it will fall where i want it to, though i'm guessing via sods law, it won't!

OK, the only rad which will be affected by the 90mm will be the living room one, and it has nothing in front of it. Bedroom one has plenty of space above it, so I'll raise it 50mm when i put the new one in to go to 150mm. Found these for the verticals, with high heat output: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vertical-Designer-Radiator-Oval-Column-Tall-Upright-Central-Heating-Radiators-UK/201641074281?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&var=500899344119&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649 No mention of brand really though. The elbows certainly sound challenging, I guess a stem elbow is still the best option if I can find a 16x2 version, which I haven't so far. I have had a look at stelrads installation instructions, and it seems you can locate the flow TRV at the top of the rad, making the TRV in a better position for sensing temperature (being off the floor), what do you think about that, or shall i just stick to the norm of both at the bottom? I just need to know before I order any smart TRV's, as they come in horizontal and vertical types EDIT: Just found these: http://www.johnguest.com/speedfit/product/12-16-20mm-size-fittings/stem-elbow-3/ Seem to come in 16mm push fit, would that work with MLCP? Cancel the edit, you can't buy them in the UK

I've just read on here: https://www.emergencyplumber.uk.com/plumbing/best-radiators/ that radiators should be a minimum of 150mm above floor level, for convection to be at its best, just checked what ours are currently and they are around 90mm, what do you think about this recommendation, worth taking note or not?

I was going to buy stelrad softline compact radiators, based on what Nick (i think it was you) said on another post about them being good quality, but I've noticed that for the same size (i.e. 600 x 600) other manufacturers seem to have the same guarantee buy more output W, which potentially means I can get a smaller radiator for the same output. Would you stick with the stelrad?

Another thing I thought of last night, how on earth do you ensure the elbow is pointing the right way, or would it naturally fall that way?? Rubber washers inside the joint?

phstore.co.uk stock these, not cheap mind!

@Nickfromwales Have I missed anything from my list?

Yeah I know, i can't think of a cheap alternative though? Theres only a small chance of vermin, but i can live with them chewing through insulation vs pipe.

the only 16mm pipe insulation i've found is only 6mm thick, so I'm going to see how tight the 15mm fits 15mm pipe, and may use that. Any additions/improvements welcome :-)

Component Quantity Price Shop Underfloor heating manifold 8 PORT 1 114.2 PSW Trade Suppliers 16mm PE-RT/AL/PE-RT 100m 1 40 PSW Trade Suppliers Pipeplus 22mm x 25m Grey Barrier Pipe 1 24.45 Plumbling and Heating Solutions Climaflex Pipe Insulation - 22mm x 19mm Wall x 2m Length 12 15.70 PlumbNation 10m Pipe Insulation 16mm - Blue 5 23 PSW Trade Suppliers 10m Pipe Insulation 16mm - Red 5 23 PSW Trade Suppliers Sentinel Eliminator Quadra Cyclone Magnetic Filter 1 55.58 PlumbNation STRAIGHT AUTO BYPASS VALVE 22MM 1 9.58 Screwfix Female Elbow 16mm - 1/2'' 8 16.80 PSW Trade Suppliers Pipeplus 15mm x 25m White Barrier Pipe 1 18.50 Plumbling and Heating Solutions Pipeplus, G15SLE,15mm Plastic Pipe Support Sleeve 1 0.15 Plumbling and Heating Solutions Calmag SI-CALCOMBI 15mm & 22mm Magnetic & Electrolytic Scale Inhibitor 1 33.70 Plumbling and Heating Solutions Climaflex Pipe Insulation - 15mm x 25mm Wall x 2m Length 50 89.40 PlumbNation 22mm Manifold connector compression 2 7.20 PSW Trade Suppliers WHITE & CHROME ANGLED TRV WITH LOCKSHIELD 15MM X ½ " 6 40.74 Screwfix Straight Braided Filling Loop - Part L 1 8.97 Toolstation

Yeah I looked at those, but for any decent size you have to get a double with 2 convectors, and they hang off of the wall quite a bit, plus they are very expensive! Seem a good idea overall though, pumping less heat into the walls.

I'd originally seen these to allow the PEX to be horizontal: https://www.plumbnation.co.uk/site/towelrads-15-15mm-pushfit-chrome-elbow/?gclid=Cj0KCQiArYDQBRDoARIsAMR8s_QfgrEpNY7eCR34kmQfaPVRGg4VrQvs3IldRN9lx-_f0OcSlDVMeIsaAu-yEALw_wcB No good for the 16mm like, i'd have to get a converter, or use the bend you suggested above and an adapter, which would be cheaper overall. Yeah not using actuators, as I plan to get Tado Smart Radiator TRVs at some point when they come down in price a bit. The Central entry point for the pipes is for a number of reasons, firstly so I only have to cut one hole in the floor, and secondly so I don't really have to worry about radiator sizes in the future and the pipes then being in the wrong place. PSW Trade Suppliers have a number of very well priced products, I've sent them an email regarding their manifold just to see what it actually comes with, but I've made a list of everything i will need for a 16mm pipe system, with manifold, which comes in at £440 for 7 radiators, which i didn't think was too bad. Actually thinking about it, instead of using the elbow, building on your suggestion, how about these? https://www.pswtradesuppliers.co.uk/en/products.php?product=Female-Elbow-16mm-%2d-1{47}2''-%2d-COMPRESSION-Fit. Not sure what size is on the end of a TRV, they do both 3/4 and 1/2, yours is half hence why i linked this one. That would get me a pretty native 16mm connection in the direction i want off of the TRV and lockshield

Yeah i've looked at several solutions. The MLCP appeals due to its strength and bending radius, plus there is the chance of mice under the floors here (it has happened before). Emmetti manifolds are nice, but once you have all the bits, very expensive. The oxygen barrier too, isn't really suitable for CH with JG and the like, and most only work to around 50C, which is below where the CH would be. Happy with the plastic look, my idea was to bring both pipes up in the centre of the radiator, up behind the rad, and bend them back down to tails off of the valves, and finally box the pipes coming from the floor to create a robust install which can't be caught by things such as hoovers. Maybe I'm going a little OTT?

My other concern over the MLCP, it all seems to mention press-fit, which seems a step backwards from pushfit? The tectite is push fit, so it seems the euro stuff is the press fit.

Finally got round to measuring all my pipe lengths, need around 100m in 15mm and 25m in 22mm. I'd got everything decided what I was going to get, a disman 8 port manifold, with tectite MLCP Pex-Al-Pex pipe, but my word is it expensive! Looking around £300 just for the pipe alone. My other option is Pipeplus, which has an EVOH oxygen barrier, and is far superior in terms of oxygen penetration compared with the likes of the JG barrier pipe, and is a much better £61 + VAT per 100m, also in the standard 15 and 22mm sizes. The tectite is clearly better overall, but would you spend the extra on it? This is just for wall hung rads, not underfloor heating. If 16mm TRV's existed, it wouldn't be an issue, i'd just go straight for the european 16mm MLCP Pex-Al-Pex pipe, which is very cheap, but I can't seem to find any. I'll try looking for radiator stems with 16mm push fit or compression ends