zoothorn

(hi chaps- sorry ill yesterday). This (^) I perfectly understand, & is the position I am in.. But to continue saying by "but it will not meet building regs if I rip up the floor.." is so bafflingly not applicable I cannot understand why you are even mentioning it. I know of course it won't meet building regs once I rip up the floor, but its of no consequence if its been signed off! so why anyone is talking about this stage after having been signed off (& deemed an 'unheated room' then? I don't know, but why should I care if BCO isn't visiting anymore-??) as if it has consequences.. is utterly bewildering!!

Can anyone else just help out here. Do I have a "heated" room, or an "unheated" room?

I dont Peter! please dont assume I'm telling you anything of the sort! you keep assuming xyz (that I didn't know why I was told to put 140mm in walls for eg). Please don't assume I'm anything but trying desperately to pick my way through your info. I just cannot understand what you are saying/ I'm tearing my hair out trying to understand your posts. If I can only read what seems to me to be you saying in one sentence I have a heated room, then the next that I have an unheated room.. I'm left thoughrally confused. Please, it just needs you to clarify. That's all. You are likely not saying both these things.. but only one.

Can someone help out here. There's a massive miscommunication, or I cannot understand PeteW's syntax.. or something very odd happening. One question for now. I have a ground floor room with 1x door/ 1x window, a concrete floor slab > 50mm insulation + 22mm chipboard floor, timber-frame walls filled with 140mm of insulation > plasterboarded.. & a ceiling of joists filled with typical orange loft insulation > plasterboarded. The BCO has determined, in u-value terms, the insulation to be as said. Is this room determined to be A) unheated, or B) heated ? Thanks.

@PeterW The problem I have is that you keep repeating that I have an unheated space (lower room). Its unnoquivocally established that I just do not. Just before, in the post with the two words in bold you contradict yourself (Ive never read such a contradiction, in my 48 yrs).. You state (assuming that I didn't know, but very simple to understand/ known for a month) why Ive been told to go up to 140mm C'tex in walls because Im going less in the floor (not 100mm.. but 50mm). So the statement is made that I am putting in insulation, in your own words. But.. The very next paragraph (with the two words in bold).. you state the total opposite: that I have an unheated room below a heated room! I do not have an unheated room (according to you). So why on earth would you say immediately after that I do?? [unless you're referring to the situation -after- the BCO has signed it off > & I undo it?? in which case no rules apply anyway.. bewildering!!].

Eh? But/ so.. you're saying if it has -got- floor insulation, then its not classed as an unheated space (which means the last two whole sentences ^ are n/a.. I just don't understand why you'd write them). It was always going to have 100mm poly insulation. Ive mentioned this (& the 50mm Im allowed to go) in almost every post. How can you possibly conclude, that I'll have an "unheated space", if I state as clear as day.. that I'm putting in 50mm floor insulation???

I'm confused by almost every word of this.. Sorry but exactly what are you referring to as irrelevant? I understand the floor has to be insulated (Ive clearly outlined doing exactly this in my posts/ then removing afterwards & re-using, again should be clear as to my idea). "ceiling as it is a ceiling above an unheated space ... you have no choice and it should be a very good insulation layer". Sorry but this is not possible to understand. 'ceiling as it is a ceiling..' eh? And 'unheated space'-? every room built is an unheated space, until you choose to put a heater in or choose not to- no?

Yes I'm looking into this (3rd job, after electrics tho): I'm thinking get rockwool-sound-slab stuff between the joists (easy), & actually within them too? here's the tricky bit: they have a frame design, each joist has a btm/top of timber & alu zzz shaped sides.. prolly only just get a typical dickension child slave's hand in.

Hi joe90- was gonna do that, mainly for sound containing/ thought I had to put the orange stuff betwwen joinsts tbh for building regs re. insulation anyway.

Ok understood/ that's a plan to consider.. assuming the BCO cannot tell &/ or wouldn't care if not glued together though. I also have to consider if removing the floor insulation.. whether the cold released will affect the (priority) dwelling-room above: this will be the master bedroom ive decided now/ makes no sense to freeze in adjacent bedroom, & as its a bit bigger than I expected. thanks Declan.

starts to spread?

Now that's a good idea, hadn't thought of laying the caber+ on the concrete/ probably a ruberry mat between or something. It was originally always going to be a low 2m ceiling with no window (with 100mm & screed included), so the idea of adding the window might have served me well after all if I'm more constrained in H by 50mm than I was originally going to be. Ok if I do your idea or mine, the same Q applies though: would you think its possible to friction-fit the Caber+, using no glue, & get it signed off? I can't see any safety issues. I wonder if the BCO would care or tell if it wasn't glued together? cheers.

Perfectly good Q. More important? I don't know, yet. This is the point of my idea: if I were to find it tollerable for H I could leave it. If its not I can undo it. Warmth is not something I have luxury of deciding on.. it just follows as a bonus if I can tollerate the low room H. If I had the 2m I specified on my plan with the floor (ideally as originally 100mm + screed both to keep me warm AND to save me £200 on additional wall insulation).. I'd not have to be even considering 50mm +22mm chipboard, let alone doing without it entirely. But afaict the builder can just change my plan to suit him, then demand I pay up by worded threats (of 10% surcharges if not done so within 14 days). A disgrace I think. 5'11".

Not quite no. When builder & I were on "compromise street" we agreed him to supply instead of 100mm poly + screed as per estimate (no idea how he was ever to 'supply' screed come to think of it).. 50mm poly + 22mm chipboard. Once BCO ok'd the idea. My plan was to lay it & undo in a way & not be damaged, use the 50mm poly up (cabin floor garden uses 2 up) & around my freezing house (eg above kitchen/ mini attic).. & use the Caber+ made into workshop tops. I dunno. The main reason is to keep room H to 2.05m which is what I measure right now factoring in ceiling pB. Actually I work 100% time standing: woodwork, cabinet covering/ everything within this room.

1.9m. I've also paid for the groundwork (because I panicked -yet again- when I saw his smallprint "if not paid in 14 days.. 10% surcharge" pressuring me to pay). Awful this has been from day 1.

But what if I don't care if it moves, or put something temporary to fix it, so I can take it up?

Another consequence of what my builder has done: ok this room was always to be low @ 2m. Its turned out to be less. Ok the reason: During build to dissuade me from asking Q's (on the wretched 1ft-set-too-low issue) he promised me "all ok as this 1ft will be added to lower room H". Ok a compromise but at least I had a higher room I thought (& all more critical stuff therefore still be as per plan). But once built I jump in & measure all panicked not only had he lied to me/ the extra H didn't happen.. but also with the original 100mm insulation + screed floor factored in (always discussed was to be the floor), later once I established it had NOT already been built in (all I could see was a concrete 'floor', all I knew was the floor him to be doing, such as the estimate 'floor & insulation below supplied' suggested to me at the time it would be his job/ & done?)............ I get a figure of 1.9m. So I had to scrape every cm to get at least 2m as per my plan. So I plead with BCO & he agrees 50mm foam + 22mm board.. but tells me I have to go 140mm wall insulation then as a result (+£200 cost). Alot of stress My builder finds both my stress & the added cost amusing. Sorry its complicated answer. Its but ONE consequence of this awful all-1ft-too-low ongoing issue I still have nothing but lies & hot air as to reasons its happened. Its actually the -least- critical consequence: if I list the others I get depressed.. lest to say I'm very angy & dissapointed..

Good point: I should have said, no plumbing at all. No electrics below either (floor to go directly onto ground floor slab). So a fairly simple proposition/ job, I hope. Any idea if I can friction-only fit the Caber+ boards together? I may have to undo/ pull up the whole floor after I get it signed off.. not possible if C4 glued together.

Hi Peter- I'll leave the electrics just for now: my head will explode if I try & consider these as well (my plan on this: get my nice spark him & me do 1st fit stuff.. then his more pro "Part-P" certified buddy he recommend, jump in to check all & 2nd fit: I'll do a thread after floor job). Just floor, 1st job then. Ok my builder didn't mention a dpm, either in the material list (just supplied poly board/ caber board) or the brief time he gave me outlining on how to do the job: I do of course have the main black dpm under slab > goes up at the edge @ block course > up over it to plinth top level. Is the dpm box ticked then?

Hi. I have an extention mostly built: builder main stuff complete. All inside xyz to do (1x floor, electrics, insulation, pB etc). I'd appreciate some help in fitting a 22mm Caber+ floor (plus 50mm C'tex below) onto a ground floor slab. I saw the same floor fitted above (on joists of this lower room's ceiling) but done so quickly before I could take pics & take any notes. Boards all stacked ready. So to start: should floor be laid before the electrics/ insulation/ plasterboard? Thanks, zoot.

Happy New Year to all on here. The builder stuff completed- bar the last "1/3rd" bill rudely promised I'd get asap [19th..] so alot depends on it as to whether I sue for damages.. but I'll leave that for now. So in the meantime, at least I don't have him turning up to work woohoo!! & can now start to consider all the 'downhill' internal stuff for me (mostly I hope) to do, in my own time: Upper room: electrics, insulation, pB. Lower room: electrics, insulation, pB, lay floor (50mm + 22mm "Caber+" chipboard). So I'll split into sections for clarity, new threads: I'd be grateful for any help & advice. Thanks, zoot.

Ok another thing I need to clarify/ opinions please. Here is the exposed foundation 'coin' on the corner of existing white wall (just to the RHS of new door here): a big block of grey slate, below which the earth/ clay is visible (one reason I didn't want to go down this low!). Is there any structural issues with this situation? should the builder have left this corner like this? I can see erosion of the soil below this block which is highly alarming, to me.

Maybe this is the stuff I was thinking of- the pic on the page tho looks like a slab type which could be prized apart (& stuffed within the alu zzz shaped joists maybe) it just looks like a much denser rockwool. I can't think its rigid like kingspan rigid..

Ok will consider.. but surely before this outer layer I can help things with regard to the load of insulation I have to put in here- this is really the only thing I'm asking about, especially relevant if I hear of "sound acoustic rockwool" which is very basically presumably the orange stuff just alot denser.

Understood.. which is why there are no windows or doors n'bors side/ a blank rendered wall.