THE new bathroom thread

[Construction Channel]

The time has come where @Onoffis about to get some competition on duration of a thread  

 

I am finally at the stage where I need to get my shower waste pipes in before I put the mesh down for the UFH. 

So far I have painted on the floor where the walls waste and shower head will go. Iv also marked out where i will be forming the “shower area”

 

my question to you all today is what size pipe would you recommend for the shower waste? 

The branch I have sticking out of the insulation has 63mm holes in ready to be drilled in the sides of it. Should I just stick with that size or reduce it down? If so why?

 

also where I need to put a bend in the pipe would you recommend I put a 45 which will be closer to the trap. Or put a 30 further down the run? Once again why? 

 

Iv Iv got some pretty dark pictures where the yellow is the shower area. The lower red dot is the waste. The higher red dot will be a ceiling mounted rain head. All the red hashing and tape at the bottom will be “under the stairs” hence why the head is so far out in the room. 

 

Any questions please ask. Obviously any help would be appreciated. 

 

ground floor plan dimensions.pdf

[PeterW]

Those branches aren’t 63mm - they are 63mm inner that takes a rubber bung into the hole and then a push fit 32/40/50mm waste. I would not be burying one of those in concrete ..!! 

 

Get a solvent strap boss the right size and bond it and the 50mm waste pipe into it, and then make a pair of 45 bends to give you your 90 degrees to the trap. 

[Construction Channel]

5 minutes ago, PeterW said:

Those branches aren’t 63mm - they are 63mm inner that takes a rubber bung into the hole and then a push fit 32/40/50mm waste. I would not be burying one of those in concrete ..!! 

 

Get a solvent strap boss the right size and bond it and the 50mm waste pipe into it, and then make a pair of 45 bends to give you your 90 degrees to the trap. 

 

That isn’t the actual fitting but they both have that size hole. Do they not make a solvent reducer for that sized hole?

 

this is the actual fitting at the bottom that is pushed directly into a swept bend from the underground pipe

 

tbh it doesn’t need to get concreted in as it’s all behind the bath so I could box around it but I’ll happily change for solvent if it’s easier. 

 

Next question why 2x 45s. why not just turn the trap? 

[PeterW]

Ahhh sorry ..! Thought you were coming up from under the floor hence the 2x45 comment. Single is fine - better than a 90. 

 

If thats above ground then it’s a standard rubber reducing ring -  solvent weld adapters available that I’ve seen recently are quite pricey and TBH you would be welding uPVC to ABS anyway in that situation unless you went with something like this and then went push fit. http://www.drainageonline.co.uk/110mm-Push-fit-Soil/40mm-Boss-Adaptor-for-Solvent-Weld-Waste.htm

 

Downside is these have a single O-Ring and aren’t that happy with offsets where the standard ones allow some adjustment 

 

http://www.drainageonline.co.uk/110mm-Push-fit-Soil/40mm-Boss-Adaptor-for-Push-Fit-Waste.htm

[Construction Channel]

Ok. But what about never being able to get back to the adaptor? Just user the rubber adaptor, box that section off so the concrete stays away from it, and make it accessible from under the stairs/ behind the bath panel? 

 

Or swap the lower section for a true solventable  boss. And concrete all around it? 

 

Also 40mm ok or stick to 50mm. It’s only a 2 m run?

[PeterW]

I’d leave as is if it’s “accessible” from the bath but just make it easy to remove in future - Cling film and expanding foam are your friend here while you concrete. 

 

40mm is fine for a short run but @Nickfromwales will be along shortly to disagree with me ... are you having a shower that can drop the contents of a tank in 2 minutes or are you going to go for a decent flow rate ..? 

[MikeSharp01]

1 hour ago, Construction Channel said:

The time has come where @Onoffis about to get some competition on duration of a thread  

 

So only 1553 posts to go. 

[Construction Channel]

9 minutes ago, PeterW said:

.. are you having a shower that can drop the contents of a tank in 2 minutes or are you going to go for a decent flow rate ..? 

 

I haven’t got that far yet. I don’t want it to be pothetic. But I also can’t afford that much so a nice middle ground will suffice. 

Just so you know there will be a separate non rain head as well but I’m a long way from messing about with those bits at the moment. 

 

Thanks for your help. 

[Construction Channel]

 Well Faye has come home and everything except the shower head and the stair wall has moved  

 

no need for the bend in the shower waste pipe now. 

 

Also I assume it will be ok the have the bath and basin on the same 2” pipe? 

 

If so I might as well bump the shower up to the same 2” so I’m not messing about with different pipe sizes. 

 

women hey,...... TBF she only said could we make the entrance wider so I moved everything to accommodate ?

[Nickfromwales]

4 hours ago, PeterW said:

I’d leave as is if it’s “accessible” from the bath but just make it easy to remove in future - Cling film and expanding foam are your friend here while you concrete. 

 

40mm is fine for a short run but @Nickfromwales will be along shortly to disagree with me ... are you having a shower that can drop the contents of a tank in 2 minutes or are you going to go for a decent flow rate ..? 

 

Why buy a 40mm pipe and wonder if it'll be ok, when you can just buy a 50mm pipe and KNOW it'll be 100% ? Don't underestimate the effect that soap suds have when filling a 40mm pipe, as when the full bore gets filled you lose the air gap and drainage becomes laboured. 50mm for me every time, and nobody comes after me to fix my problems . 

 

5 hours ago, Construction Channel said:

Do they not make a solvent reducer for that sized hole?

Its a big fat NO to using the rubber 50mm bung, instead you want one of these and use this stuff to glue it all together. Once that goes off you can jump all over it and it'll stay rock solid. Only switch back to regular solvent weld when it's the waste pipe and fittings your doing. You may need to match the soil fitting and the 50mm insert / reducer manufacturer to get a proper fit / compatibility. 

If the shower run goes under the bath, and the bath panel is removable, then fit a sweep tee facing into the flow so it comes up beside the bath with a rodding eye so you can rod from the stack to the shower trap. Some shower traps can be 'opened' and you can easily rod from the trap to the stack, so adjust accordingly for whatever you decide on. 

 

3 hours ago, Construction Channel said:

Also I assume it will be ok the have the bath and basin on the same 2” pipe? 

Yes, with ease. Either fit an AAV ( air admittance ) valve upstream of the tee point under the bath, or fit an anti-vacuum / siphon trap on the basin, like this to stop any glugs from the basin whilst the bath empties. 

 

 

[Construction Channel]

6 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said:

 

Why buy a 40mm pipe and wonder if it'll be ok, when you can just buy a 50mm pipe and KNOW it'll be 100% ? Don't underestimate the effect that soap suds have when filling a 40mm pipe, as when the full bore gets filled you lose the air gap and drainage becomes laboured. 50mm for me every time, and nobody comes after me to fix my problems . 

4

 

Done....Easy

6 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said:

 

Its a big fat NO to using the rubber 50mm bung, instead you want one of these and use this stuff to glue it all together. Once that goes off you can jump all over it and it'll stay rock solid. Only switch back to regular solvent weld when it's the waste pipe and fittings your doing. You may need to match the soil fitting and the 50mm insert / reducer manufacturer to get a proper fit / compatibility. 

2

 

will that glue be ok to use on the current fittings I have if I rough them up a bit or do I need to change them to solvent weld fittings?

6 hours ago, Construction Channel said:

 

 

 

 

6 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said:

If the shower run goes under the bath, and the bath panel is removable, then fit a sweep tee facing into the flow so it comes up beside the bath with a rodding eye so you can rod from the stack to the shower trap. Some shower traps can be 'opened' and you can easily rod from the trap to the stack, so adjust accordingly for whatever you decide on. 

 

 

it's not anymore, that stack will be getting boxed in next to the throne now all the way to the ceiling so access can be easy from the cupboard under the stairs or the boxing.

 on that note whats wrong with this?

 

http://www.drainage-channel.co.uk/category-6092/SD200.html

6 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said:

 

Yes, with ease. Either fit an AAV ( air admittance ) valve upstream of the tee point under the bath, or fit an anti-vacuum / siphon trap on the basin, like this to stop any glugs from the basin whilst the bath empties. 

 

 

anti-vacuum trap...done

[Nickfromwales]

No need to rough them up tbh, just use a solvent cleaner first to remove any contaminants. Try to rotate the fittings after you've pushed them home, as that tends to give a good key. 

Shower tile / trap looks good to me. 

[Construction Channel]

1 minute ago, Nickfromwales said:

No need to rough them up tbh, just use a solvent cleaner first to remove any contaminants. Try to rotate the fittings after you've pushed them home, as that tends to give a good key. 

Shower tile / trap looks good to me. 

good enough for me, I'll get it ordered tomorrow, 

 

Thanks for your help 

[Nickfromwales]

That solvent filler works on most stuff, so I'll be suprised if it's not compatible with what you've already got. The issue is the compatibility of the reducer I linked and the fittings you already have. Likelihood is that you can source the matching suitable reducer to correspond ?

[PeterW]

6 hours ago, Nickfromwales said:

The issue is the compatibility of the reducer I linked and the fittings you already have. Likelihood is that you can source the matching suitable reducer to correspond ?

 

That was my concern hence going with rubber which should last a lifetime if it’s properly fitted and kept out of sunlight. 

 

@Construction Channel who’s grey pipework is it ..??

[Nickfromwales]

42 minutes ago, PeterW said:

 

That was my concern hence going with rubber which should last a lifetime if it’s properly fitted and kept out of sunlight. 

 

@Construction Channel who’s grey pipework is it ..??

I just like the ability to yank on the waste pipe all I like after welding it all to the stack. With the rubber bung, you sneeze and out it comes. 

Theyre ok if it's all timber work and you can clip the pipes, but even then I just can't see any reason to use them when you can buy the all solvent solution just as easily and it's a far far better job IMO. I always worry about them pulling out......no such worry with solvent weld.

The only con with solvent weld is you get one shot to get it right as the glue goes off very quickly. The way to avoid distaster is to mock up dry, number and mark the pipe and fitting at each junction and then you can just glue one pipe and one fitting at a time, gluing and twisting until the marker lines line up. Draw two or three lines ( across the fitting and onto the pipe ) as it's easy to get a single line not quite lined up properly, not so easy with multiple lines  

[Construction Channel]

1 hour ago, PeterW said:

 

 

@Construction Channel who’s grey pipework is it ..??

 

Mine. It came from bp plastics. 

[Nickfromwales]

3 hours ago, Construction Channel said:

 

Mine. It came from bp plastics. 

Just ring and ask if they do the solvent insert reducer.  

[Construction Channel]

all ordered, I got a bunch of spare fittings aswell just to get free delivery  also went for the AAV in the end as it was cheap and I saw it on the list....

[Construction Channel]

Evening everyone we’re back to messing about with the bathroom. 

Before we get into all my new toys we had better get the technical stuff out of the way.

The shower is a straight run now so plain sailing I hope. I will box off where the yellow hashing is when I pour the slab then screed it to a fall later on. I have angled back the access point so I can have a smaller boxing but I am happy with this bit unless someone tells me I shouldn’t be. 

 

Next bit is the bath and basin. Plan is to be in the concrete along the back wall behind the bath. I will angle the first T up and out of the concrete to take the bath waste. Then it will continue along into the corner where it will come up again to the T which will go above the concrete to the basin with the AAV above it (still behind the bath) after the T I was just planing for a bend going up to the basin or would it be better to put a rodding access here? 

 

Does anyone one have any issues with this so far? Otherwise I’m going to get the glue out ?. 

 

Im here all night so please ask as many questions as necessary 

[Construction Channel]

Now for the tools ?

obviously as I have no idea to stand half a chance I NEED all the gear. 

 

First job is coring out for the boss adaptor. I already own some hole saws and arbours but not the right size so I have treated myself to a nice new 14 piece quick change Bosch hole saw set (£88) 

now it would be far too easy if the kit had the only size I actually need  so I had to buy a 60mm one separately but I didn’t find that out until the kit turned up ?

 

next job job is to cut some 2” pipe. I already own a hacksaw and grinder but who uses that rubbish anymore. All 3 sizes of plastic pipe slices (£50) and they work a treat. 

 

now you you might think surely that is enough to get on with the job but you would be wrong. Even with the fantastic pipe slices I was ever so worried about nasty burrs on my pipe so I bought a nice debarred for (£8) 

 

so now I have all the gear and a forum. What could possibly go wrong ?

[Onoff]

I'd put a rodding eye where you can. You won't really see it behind the sink. Wall mount or pedestal btw? Will you have space to the wall out of the picture to get rods in?

[Construction Channel]

4 minutes ago, Onoff said:

I'd put a rodding eye where you can. You won't really see it behind the sink. Wall mount or pedestal btw? Will you have space to the wall out of the picture to get rods in?

It’s a pedestal at the moment so was hoping o could just rod from the trap but I’m not against hiding an access where I box between that and the bath. 

 

I should have have said I will be putting an angle on the rodding access near the stack so it points straight up for this exact reason. I just haven’t got the bend here to show it. 

[Construction Channel]

Change of plan. The shower trap is easily rodable so I’m going to get rid of the other access on that run. 

 

Now I can use that y and another 45 to get up to the basin and allow access from there. 

[Declan52]

Have you any recess holes planned in. Think they really look the part. Will be redoing my shower in the  upstairs bathroom in the next couple of months so have been flat out looking at loads of design options all which include recess holes like in the pic below.