Updated Concept

[jaymd_123]

Hello,

Adding my updated floor plans based on feedback from this group previously. My wife and I have messed around with more 1.5/1.75 plans, but we're struggling to make it work with space, so we are playing around with a bungalow again. 

This design is 215m2 (177 + garage). We figured with this layout we could build the garage later if we cannot build to our £1400m2 budget. The garage is deliberately oversized, as it will be used as a workshop/gym/art/drumkit room lol. The car will never be in there.

I'd love constructive feedback on the flow and general layout. Anything you see that will cause annoyance which I may have not spotted? So far, I think the office leading to the living room is really all I can pick out, and that's not a big deal to me.

Disclaimer: All my designs are concepts  - we're still looking for land within a town in Perthshire, Scotland. I'm aware that designing a house without land isn't the norm, but we're using the design process to understand what we want, as a learning tool, and because we enjoy it. If that doesn't work for you, please feel free to move on. I'll no doubt use any feedback to create updated versions, so to keep it all in one place, dumping here

Thanks!

Edited October 7 by jaymd_123

[jaymd_123]

[Bozza]

Honestly, don’t waste anymore time on this.  Wait until you get a plot.  That design & layout may be totally unsuitable for the plot you buy.   

 

You have some nice ideas, the rear overhang is nice and having the main living / kitchen area are strong.   But your interior layout has some obvious problems including basic things like interior hallways with zero natural light, insufficient entrance hallway space, and walking through a room to get to another room.

 

I had my ideas and designs prior to finding a plot.  This impacted negatively on my final design as I had a mindset of what I thought we wanted and tried to force that into our design.  With hindsight I should have approached my plot with a far more open mind.

 

Keep a portfolio of images, rooms, like the one in your post by all means.  When you get the plot either get an architect, get some inspiration from other house designs online, or seek advice here in particular from the likes of those with expertise like @ETC

 

That would be my best and honest advice, but would caveat this by saying it’s your house / your money etc….

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[mjc55]

Have to agree with Bozza re spending time on a layout before you have the plot, I'm really not so sure that you are helping yourself to be honest.

 

The plot you buy will give you so much more regarding orientation and shape and layout than any theoretical exercise!

 

I worked as an AT for 10 years or so and the last thing I ever wanted on first look at a potential change to a property was other people ideas, for me it took away some of the spontaneity that happens when you look at something with fresh eyes. 

[jaymd_123]

13 minutes ago, Bozza said:

Honestly, don’t waste anymore time on this.  Wait until you get a plot.  That design & layout may be totally unsuitable for the plot you buy.   

 

You have some nice ideas, the rear overhang is nice and having the main living / kitchen area are strong.   But your interior layout has some obvious problems including basic things like interior hallways with zero natural light, insufficient entrance hallway space, and walking through a room to get to another room.

 

I had my ideas and designs prior to finding a plot.  This impacted negatively on my final design as I had a mindset of what I thought we wanted and tried to force that into our design.  With hindsight I should have approached my plot with a far more open mind.

 

Keep a portfolio of images, rooms, like the one in your post by all means.  When you get the plot either get an architect, get some inspiration from other house designs online, or seek advice here in particular from the likes of those with expertise like @ETC

 

That would be my best and honest advice, but would caveat this by saying it’s your house / your money etc….

Hey Bozza. Thanks for feeding in!

Completely aware of the general view on designing without land. I tried to make this clear in my post, we're using the design process to understand what we want, as a learning tool, and because we enjoy it. Ultimately, until we have land, we can't do anything other than research and plan; this is part of our process. Completely respectful of your feedback of course, and your suggestions are good and noted.

In terms of lighting hallways for example, is this not fixable with roof lighting (my design program doesn't allow me to add this unfortunately). I'd be keen to know which room you're referring to "walking through a room to get to another room." Do you mean the kids snug? I can close this off, but my view was to keep this end of the house for the kids. Utility into Mech I think makes sense but please correct me if I'm wrong.

Any suggestions how I can create a larger entrance space? Being honest, the entrance hall was really the room we care about less lol. We just wanted an area to enter the house which wasn't directly into the living space and had somewhere to store coats and shoes, but would love to hear suggestions if you have any.

Thanks again!

[jaymd_123]

4 minutes ago, mjc55 said:

Have to agree with Bozza re spending time on a layout before you have the plot, I'm really not so sure that you are helping yourself to be honest.

 

The plot you buy will give you so much more regarding orientation and shape and layout than any theoretical exercise!

 

I worked as an AT for 10 years or so and the last thing I ever wanted on first look at a potential change to a property was other people ideas, for me it took away some of the spontaneity that happens when you look at something with fresh eyes. 

Gotcha. Seems like a theme. Not sure if people are missing what I'm trying to achieve (using the design process to understand what we want, as a learning tool, and because we enjoy it) or if I am being completely naive and wasting my time and others by posting this here. Apologies if it's the latter. 

[jaymd_123]

11 minutes ago, mjc55 said:

I worked as an AT for 10 years or so and the last thing I ever wanted on first look at a potential change to a property was other people ideas, for me it took away some of the spontaneity that happens when you look at something with fresh eyes.

This is really interesting. I hadn't really looked at it from this angle. Any advice on how I can get the ball rolling? Financially, we're good to go if we can find a plot... It's just finding a plot on the open market that has slowed us down the last two years.

[mjc55]

2 minutes ago, jaymd_123 said:

Gotcha. Seems like a theme. Not sure if people are missing what I'm trying to achieve (using the design process to understand what we want, as a learning tool, and because we enjoy it) or if I am being completely naive and wasting my time and others by posting this here. Apologies if it's the latter. 

I was going to edit my post to add that at the end of the day it is totally up to you how you approach this.  It's an exciting time working towards a self-build and for us, as soon as we got the land it soon became apparent in lots of ways what we would attempt to build.

 

There is also some merit in looking at options and posting on here as people will point out, what appears to them, glaring errors!  At your stage they are not errors just points on a path.

 

Good luck with looking for land - in some ways that is the hardest part of the process!  Actually getting PP is the hardest part, or maybe building it 😁

[jaymd_123]

1 minute ago, mjc55 said:

Good luck with looking for land - in some ways that is the hardest part of the process!  Actually getting PP is the hardest part, or maybe building it 😁

This made me chuckle. Land has been really tough to come by. My wife has very strict criteria which I think I will need to manage expectations or I could be posting useless designs here for the next 20 years.

 

2 minutes ago, mjc55 said:

There is also some merit in looking at options and posting on here as people will point out, what appears to them, glaring errors!  At your stage they are not errors just points on a path.

Well put. We've been calling local estates, searching the web, we've even handed out flyers searching for land. Designing keeps the dream a live a little... That and reading books (I still feel widely under-educated in the area).

[mjc55]

3 minutes ago, jaymd_123 said:

This is really interesting. I hadn't really looked at it from this angle. Any advice on how I can get the ball rolling? Financially, we're good to go if we can find a plot... It's just finding a plot on the open market that has slowed us down the last two years.

I can give no advice other than keep looking and something will find you!  That is the attitude that we had and after 2 years of looking at sites that were OK, but didn't float our boat.  Eventually ours came up at auction and we just knew it was meant for us and that we could at last scratch an itch that had been there for 30 years or so.

 

When we were looking we really had no idea of what our build would look like, single storey/two storey/orientation/size none of this was something we thought about.  When we found the plot we started looking at what we might build and by a process of elimination came to our submitted plan.  (After months of sorting out a discrepancy in the boundary that was on the LR plan!)

[Bozza]

Ok….so if this is more about learning how to design a house yourself, for your needs…..and doing so as an interim source of pleasure until you get your plot (which is exactly what I did),… what I’d advise you to do is design houses based upon actual real plots that you see in your area, or even further afield.     As such you’ll learn about how to incorporate your needs into specific plots.   I think that would be more helpful as a learning opportunity.

 

Inevitably you’ll get the best advice here based upon actual plot as it’s so incredibly relevant to the house design.

 

but a word of caution….if your house design is your “baby”, as it can sometime be for most of us, be prepared for folk to tell you they think you’ve got an ugly baby   Nobody want to do that of course but creative criticism can drive your forward to a better design.

 

 

 

  
 

 

[Bozza]

…and if your struggling to find a plot have you considered buying something to demo…that’s how we did it as couldn’t find a suitable plot in the right location. 

[Alan Ambrose]

>>> using the design process to understand what we want, as a learning tool

 

Yeah, that's a perfectly valid design technique. You're the customer, do whatever you want. You might like to consider what orientations (sun, views etc) work well with your designs.

 

As are mood boards, magazine clipping files, physical models etc etc etc. If you have the time and energy, there's nothing to stop you thinking about construction teechniques, insulation amounts, plant etc. And reading the 'ub here to learn a lot.

 

[jaymd_123]

9 minutes ago, Bozza said:

Ok….so if this is more about learning how to design a house yourself, for your needs…..and doing so as an interim source of pleasure until you get your plot (which is exactly what I did),… what I’d advise you to do is design houses based upon actual real plots that you see in your area, or even further afield.     As such you’ll learn about how to incorporate your needs into specific plots.   I think that would be more helpful as a learning opportunity.

 

Inevitably you’ll get the best advice here based upon actual plot as it’s so incredibly relevant to the house design.

 

but a word of caution….if your house design is your “baby”, as it can sometime be for most of us, be prepared for folk to tell you they think you’ve got an ugly baby   Nobody want to do that of course but creative criticism can drive your forward to a better design.

You got it! Maybe my wording was wrong; I probably should have said "house designs, not for any specific plot" as really that's what this is. I know ETC is going to rip me apart  I can take it lol.

Your idea of building to actual plots is a really good idea. I can certainly see value in that. Would allow me to pit the plot against the design to get feedback, too. Which is the aim of the game!

[Jilly]

Another area to explore is converting an existing building, barn, stable etc. More/different loopholes to jump through, plus, it could go over your budget. 

[jaymd_123]

6 minutes ago, Alan Ambrose said:

>>> using the design process to understand what we want, as a learning tool

 

Yeah, that's a perfectly valid design technique. You're the customer, do whatever you want. You might like to consider what orientations (sun, views etc) work well with your designs.

 

As are mood boards, magazine clipping files, physical models etc etc etc. If you have the time and energy, there's nothing to stop you thinking about construction teechniques, insulation amounts, plant etc. And reading the 'ub here to learn a lot.

Appreciate the feedback, Alan. considering the orientation is similar advise as to what Bozza mentioned about designing on other existing plots, and is a solid idea. Looking to accelerate my understanding of why houses are designed the way they are, so this will be valuable. 

As you say, this forum is proving to be valuable already. Looking at construction techniques, it would appear most of it is covered here. One thing I couldn't find on this form was Stickys (tutorials/intros/guides to cover the basics) but I'm sure I can find most of info through separate forms and project blogs.

[jaymd_123]

3 minutes ago, Jilly said:

Another area to explore is converting an existing building, barn, stable etc. More/different loopholes to jump through, plus, it could go over your budget. 

So, funny you say that, Jilly. We initially started out planning for a stedding we found but lost to another buyer. We've renovated three properties and I truly believe building from scratch is going to be easier than converting an existing building. We're still doing work on the 1800s build we're in now. Great experience though. Learned to plaster, lay basic central heating, brick slip, tiling, roofing etc. All pretty small jobs, but I recon I can take the skills earned and scale them to some extent.

[jaymd_123]

20 hours ago, Bozza said:

But your interior layout has some obvious problems including basic things like interior hallways with zero natural light, insufficient entrance hallway space, and walking through a room to get to another room.

Thanks again for the great advice. I see what you mean. I've played around with the plans to incorporate your feedback and thought about natural lighting in the hallways and the entrance's size. My wife and I agreed that we do like the kid's nook not being a separate room so chose not to close this off (not sure if this is what you meant about walking through a room into another). We don't see an issue walking through a utility into the mech/garage.

To make this work, we had to swap the ensuite and the bedroom horizontally. This places the bedroom next to the living room -- will this be an issue? Also, allowed me to add a toilet in the entrance room which we can also use to hang jackets.

Would love to hear feedback/thoughts/observations. Try not to be brutal 🤣 

[G and J]

All very personal taste I know, but if the ensuite is steamy will opening it up to the closet work.....I also woudn't fancy either having to wait or worse, walk past someone on the loo......I know true love knows no bounds but.....

[jaymd_123]

49 minutes ago, G and J said:

but if the ensuite is steamy will opening it up to the closet work

I hadn't thought of this. Good catch.

 

 

50 minutes ago, G and J said:

I also woudn't fancy either having to wait or worse, walk past someone on the loo

Also a good point. Not sure having to wait is a show-stopper, but I wouldn't want to share the experience going on in the loo as you say lol.

Thanks for the feedback! Really useful.

[mjc55]

Must admit I am not a fan of rooms with no windows, I know that they are mainly bathrooms but given the overall shape of the house it would be difficult not to do what you have!

[jaymd_123]

8 minutes ago, mjc55 said:

Must admit I am not a fan of rooms with no windows,

Completely agree.

I've updated the plan based on @G and J's feedback. This leaves me with two rooms without windows: the closet and the second bathroom. The closet I can live with. The bathroom, I could personally live with (I had no windows in one of my last property's bathrooms and it caused no issues or annoyance). That said, of course, I would prefer natural light. Could this be fixed with a roof light? The bathroom is pretty central and would cause the window to be close to the roof apex, so may not work. Unfortunately, the software I'm using doesn't have a roof light option so I can't test that option.

[ProDave]

For the inner bathroom a light tunnel or solar tube works well, we had one in a previous house to light an otherwise dark landing and it worked well.

 

That revised layout flows a lot better.

[jaymd_123]

26 minutes ago, ProDave said:

For the inner bathroom a light tunnel or solar tube works well,

Great idea. Thanks for noting. We had one in our living room in Galatina, Italy when we stayed there a few months back. It worked far better than I expected - I completely forgot about it. Do you think it would be beneficial to add these to the living space, too? Very conscious the room is pretty large and the windows are at the far ends.

Any thoughts on cost-saving potentials on this sort of layout? Anything I should consider?

Edited October 8 by jaymd_123

[mjc55]

Agree a light tube would really help.

 

Also think that main living area could do with something - potentially gloomy.  But of course that does go back to orientation somewhat.