Jimbouk Posted October 21, 2017 Share Posted October 21, 2017 (edited) Am I correct in thinking that there are two SAP assesments, one prior to starting and one when actually built? Since our initial assessment, we have progressed with the build, now at second fix. Unsurprisingly we have made some changes to the original specification. We have increased the amount of glazing to a Southerly aspect, now have underfloor heating installed rather than radiators. Now looking at not installing a gas combi boiler, instead a couple of Ellis water heaters for the ufh heating and a hot water tank with an electric immersion. It is for a holiday home at present, so not going to get intensive use. Can always install the gas fired solution in the future if required. Also, owing to some project scope creep, funds are dwindling, so the log burner may not be installed as originally planned, once again maybe in the future. On the plus side I’m hoping we will be a lot more airtight that the 5 used in the original SAP. Just wondering how this is going to impact on my final SAP, do I just wait and see? Can I end up ‘failing’ ? If so what then? Edited October 21, 2017 by Jimbouk Additional info Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_L Posted October 21, 2017 Share Posted October 21, 2017 44 minutes ago, Jimbouk said: Am I correct in thinking that there are two SAP assesments, one prior to starting and one when actually built? Just wondering how this is going to impact on my final SAP, do I just wait and see? Can I end up ‘failing’ ? If so what then? Yes there is a PEA, predicted energy assessment and an final 'As built' SAP. One of the major hurdles is to get your CO2 emission (DER or Dwelling Emission Rate) below a target emission rate (TER). The TER is based on natural gas which has a CO2 rate (g/kWh) of about 40% that of electricity. So it would be very easy to fail this. You need to get your OCDEA to assess this ASAP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbouk Posted October 21, 2017 Author Share Posted October 21, 2017 Thanks, but what is an OCDEA? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_L Posted October 21, 2017 Share Posted October 21, 2017 OCDEA - On Construction Domestic Energy Assessor. The person who did your initial assessment will be able to advise on the effect of the fuel change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Harris Posted October 21, 2017 Share Posted October 21, 2017 11 minutes ago, Jimbouk said: Thanks, but what is an OCDEA? On Construction Domestic Energy Assessor. Someone who never looks at your house, takes the information the builder/you gives them and then lodges the EPC officially. The government have tied the system up so that only accredited assessors (who never actually see what they are accrediting.........) are permitted to lodge the as-built assessment. For example, I did all the assessment, calculations, physically checked and double checked the as-built specification, including making sure with my own eyes the specification, workmanship and paperwork for every single part of our build was correct, but was not permitted to submit the final EPC. I had to pay someone who had nothing but the evidence I gave them to do this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbouk Posted October 21, 2017 Author Share Posted October 21, 2017 Thanks, guess I’ll get back in touch with the surveyors that are doing the building regs and warranty inspections. I have all the data from the PER, which says the TER also, is there such a thing as an online calculator I can use? I understand I’ll need to get the final version done professionally. I assume that if I don’t meet the TER, then no building regs sign off? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Harris Posted October 21, 2017 Share Posted October 21, 2017 1 minute ago, Jimbouk said: Thanks, guess I’ll get back in touch with the surveyors that are doing the building regs and warranty inspections. I have all the data from the PER, which says the TER also, is there such a thing as an online calculator I can use? I understand I’ll need to get the final version done professionally. I assume that if I don’t meet the TER, then no building regs sign off? You can download and use FSAP for free: https://www.stromamembers.co.uk/downloads/fsap2012/publish.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADLIan Posted October 21, 2017 Share Posted October 21, 2017 Beware!!! Switching from gas space/water heating (especially heated floor) to mains electric will totally screw up the CO2 emissions. Failure here under the Regs is very difficult/expensive to remedy! Your assessor should be able to advise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curlewhouse Posted October 24, 2017 Share Posted October 24, 2017 As above - switching to electric will alter things a lot. We were originally going for ASHP for our heating, then on going to LPG our rating improved greatly (as did the installation cost - enough to pay for many,many years of gas) The reason I was given was that enough of our electricity is still generated in more polluting ways than using a gas boiler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbouk Posted October 29, 2017 Author Share Posted October 29, 2017 Thanks all, looks like I have choice of reverting back to main gas and associated system or install a 2Kw PV system. Gas it is then... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbouk Posted January 8, 2018 Author Share Posted January 8, 2018 Thread resurrection! Having spent a day early last month trying to find the existing gas supply by our boundary for West and Wales Utilities to connect to, and failing. I am trying to resolve the gas connection issue. Will start a different thread on this. However visited the house today, no-one has been there since before Christmas. Just starting second fix, walls plastered, no heating source in place. Located near the coast in East Devon, with a fairly sheltered Southerly aspect, has a large overhang to the Southerly aspect, providing Summer shading, but allowing solar gain in the Winter, this elevation being almost all glazing. Despite being in the low single figure temperatures outside the last few weeks, with a couple of frosts, I was amazed to discover the internal temperature today was 12 degrees! I was expecting 5 or 6 at best, and had been worrying that the ufh system might have frozen... So this indicates to me that all the insulation and solar gain is working brilliantly, and that I'm probably not going to need much additional heat to get it to a sensible habitable level. Even more reason why having to go to the expense of gas supply, gas boiler, maintenance and standing charges is grating... as per earlier in this thread, a willis heater and immersion look as if they will be solution except for the fact that I will fail the final EPC, unless I install a pv system. Surely there must be another solution? I need some creativity! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trw144 Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 If you happy with a Willis heater in future, what about a cheap/second hand air source heat pump to start with? I believe, once your “signed off” by building control then you can do whatever changes you want to your heating system, and I don’t know exactly how much they will check when it comes to the installation of the heat pump either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 Most new ASHP installs need planning permission - check your Council planning website carefully ..! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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