What do you all think about the recent sea temps?

[gavztheouch]

Last year I was following the news about the rise of the sea temps. I know the start of el nino had something to do with it but the chart was way higher than before and this year is worse. These measurement are an average of thousands of different sensors so they must be accurate and also unlikely to be wrong. 

 

I heard speculation that this might be something to do with the removal of sulfur from shipping fuel, which reduced particles in the upper atomsphere allowing more light in.

 

Anyone else feeling distraught at the speed of warming at this rate we are going to be in trouble very soon and there is no clear way back.

 

I don't see any other option but to massively slow down human activity.

Edited February 29 by gavztheouch

[gavztheouch]

To add some context I think about this a lot in relation to building my house. What materials I use (embodied energy) and also will it still be here is 40 years time (I'm 10m above sea level ) or will it be flooded.

[RobLe]

 

[gc100]

(Most) People aren’t even thinking about the ocean. If it gets too warm plankton will die - which is responsible for 20% of the oxygen in the biosphere- that’s a higher percentage than all of the tropical rainforests on land combined!

 

The world is going to sh@t , with governments preoccupied with declining economies and aging populations, looming wars, etc and taking their eye of climate actions. I worry about my young kids and the life they are going to have to deal with 

[Temp]

Hot Model...

 

 

 

 

[SteamyTea]

I have an interest in climate change, even bothered to go to university to study it.  My interest is quite niche in that I was studying the effect of cloud cover, which is not the same as the studying the effect of climate change on cloud cover.

Yesterday's Inside Science was was about geoengineering our climate, mainly adding aerosols into the atmosphere.  Not a good move in my opinion as it does nothing to stop ocean acidification, which was not mentioned on the program.

l last year, there was an incident of excess worming in the Atlantic, many down here (in Cornwall) liked it as it meant they could go swimming.  In June, 2023, it peaked at around 19°C, which is about the same temperature it peaks at in in August.

 

I am not sure of the long term affects of this marine 'weather' event, but there will be some.

 

 

 

[Originaltwist]

When you consider that most of the planet is covered by water -which naturally evaporates-  then any rise in temperature will have to make more rain. Where will it all fall? Well. England obvs.

[SteamyTea]

20 minutes ago, Originaltwist said:

When you consider that most of the planet is covered by water -which naturally evaporates-  then any rise in temperature will have to make more rain. Where will it all fall? Well. England obvs.

Certainly seems true this year so far.

 

But, a quick look at my news feed.

 

https://news.google.com/articles/CBMiLGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmJiYy5jby51ay9uZXdzL2J1c2luZXNzLTY4NDY3NTI50gEwaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuYmJjLmNvLnVrL25ld3MvYnVzaW5lc3MtNjg0Njc1MjkuYW1w?hl=en-GB&gl=GB&ceid=GB%3Aen

 

https://news.google.com/articles/CBMic2h0dHBzOi8vd3d3LnRoZWd1YXJkaWFuLmNvbS93b3JsZC8yMDI0L21hci8wNS9pY2UtZnJlZS1zdW1tZXJzLWluLWFyY3RpYy1wb3NzaWJsZS13aXRoaW4tbmV4dC1kZWNhZGUtc2NpZW50aXN0cy1zYXnSAQA?hl=en-GB&gl=GB&ceid=GB%3Aen

 

https://news.google.com/articles/CBMidWh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LnJldXRlcnMuY29tL2J1c2luZXNzL2Vudmlyb25tZW50L3dvcmxkLWJyaW5rLWZvdXJ0aC1tYXNzLWNvcmFsLXJlZWYtYmxlYWNoaW5nLWV2ZW50LW5vYWEtc2F5cy0yMDI0LTAzLTA1L9IBAA?hl=en-GB&gl=GB&ceid=GB%3Aen

 

https://news.google.com/articles/CBMimQFodHRwczovL3d3dy5oaW5kdXN0YW50aW1lcy5jb20vaW5kaWEtbmV3cy9iZW5nYWx1cnUtd2F0ZXItY3Jpc2lzLWdyaW0tYXMtMy0wMDAtYm9yZXdlbGxzLWRyaWVkLXVwLXRhbmtlcnMtcHJpY2VzLXNreXJvY2tldC0xMC1wb2ludHMtMTAxNzA5NjQ5NzMxNDkxLmh0bWzSAQA?hl=en-GB&gl=GB&ceid=GB%3Aen

 

https://news.google.com/articles/CBMibmh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LnJldXRlcnMuY29tL3dvcmxkL2V1cm9wZS9ncmVlY2UtcmVjb3Jkcy1ob3R0ZXN0LWV2ZXItd2ludGVyLXJhaXNpbmctZmVhcnMtc3VtbWVyLWZpcmVzLTIwMjQtMDMtMDQv0gEA?hl=en-GB&gl=GB&ceid=GB%3Aen

 

https://news.google.com/articles/CBMisgFodHRwczovL3RoZWNvbnZlcnNhdGlvbi5jb20vYXJjdGljLXJpdmVycy1mYWNlLWJpZy1jaGFuZ2VzLXdpdGgtYS13YXJtaW5nLWNsaW1hdGUtcGVybWFmcm9zdC10aGF3LWFuZC1hbi1hY2NlbGVyYXRpbmctd2F0ZXItY3ljbGUtdGhlLWVmZmVjdHMtd2lsbC1oYXZlLWdsb2JhbC1jb25zZXF1ZW5jZXMtMjI0ODY50gEA?hl=en-GB&gl=GB&ceid=GB%3Aen

 

https://news.google.com/articles/CBMihAFodHRwczovL3d3dy5ldXJvbmV3cy5jb20vZ3JlZW4vMjAyNC8wMy8wNC93YXRlci1yZXN0cmljdGlvbnMtaW5jcmVhc2VkLXByaWNlcy1hbmQtaW1wcmlzb25tZW50LWhvdy1pcy10dW5pc2lhLWJhdHRsaW5nLTUteWVhcnMtb2YtZHLSAQA?hl=en-GB&gl=GB&ceid=GB%3Aen

 

https://news.google.com/articles/CBMiZmh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LnRoZWd1YXJkaWFuLmNvbS9jb21tZW50aXNmcmVlLzIwMjQvbWFyLzA0L3dhdGVyLXdvcmxkLXJ1bi1vdXQtcGxhbmV0LWhvdHRlci1sb29taW5nLWNyaXNpc9IBZmh0dHBzOi8vYW1wLnRoZWd1YXJkaWFuLmNvbS9jb21tZW50aXNmcmVlLzIwMjQvbWFyLzA0L3dhdGVyLXdvcmxkLXJ1bi1vdXQtcGxhbmV0LWhvdHRlci1sb29taW5nLWNyaXNpcw?hl=en-GB&gl=GB&ceid=GB%3Aen

 

https://news.google.com/articles/CBMifmh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LnRoZWd1YXJkaWFuLmNvbS9lbnZpcm9ubWVudC8yMDI0L21hci8wMi9pdC1tYWtlcy1tZS1zby1zYWQtY2h1cmNoLXJlZW1lcmdlcy1mcm9tLXJlc2Vydm9pci1hcy1zcGFpbi1mYWNlcy1kcm91Z2h0c9IBfmh0dHBzOi8vYW1wLnRoZWd1YXJkaWFuLmNvbS9lbnZpcm9ubWVudC8yMDI0L21hci8wMi9pdC1tYWtlcy1tZS1zby1zYWQtY2h1cmNoLXJlZW1lcmdlcy1mcm9tLXJlc2Vydm9pci1hcy1zcGFpbi1mYWNlcy1kcm91Z2h0cw?hl=en-GB&gl=GB&ceid=GB%3Aen

https://news.google.com/articles/CBMiXmh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmV1cm9uZXdzLmNvbS9ncmVlbi8yMDI0LzAzLzAxL3N0YXRlLW9mLWVtZXJnZW5jeS1kZWNsYXJlZC1pbi1zaWNpbHktZHVlLXRvLWRyb3VnaHTSAQA?hl=en-GB&gl=GB&ceid=GB%3Aen

 

 

 

[SteamyTea]

This one was interesting though.

 

https://eos.org/articles/mapping-the-oceans-motion-energy

 

 

And this one.

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-68438582

 

Edited March 6 by SteamyTea

[BotusBuild]

14 minutes ago, SteamyTea said:

https://eos.org/articles/mapping-the-oceans-motion-energy

OMG - the Perpertual Ocean youtube video in that article is mesmerising

[Post and beam]

Years ago i read that the gradual clearing of the atmosphere of particulates due to industrial process's and agriculture might be as effective at increasing evaporation as any rise in temperature.

I have no academic credentials but this was the first thing i found when i googled the effect....

 

In a surprising finding, light can make water evaporate without heat | MIT News | Massachusetts Institute of Technology

[SteamyTea]

2 hours ago, Post and beam said:

In a surprising finding, light can make water evaporate without heat | MIT News | Massachusetts Institute of Technology

I don't know why they were surprised.  Probably need a better thermometer and gas analyser.

 

Maybe they forget that heat is the old word for energy and when you get down to the quantum level (parts of atoms, so very tiny distances and sizes), a photon is just a packet of energy and can easily knock at electron free from a molecule, what plants to all the time (how they convert CO₂ and H₂O to C, H, CO, HO, complex CH molecules as well as all the other elements that are in the plant).

 

So what is probably happening is that a loosely bound (hot) water molecule is split into hydrogen and oxygen by the energy in a photon (photons have different energies/intensities) and evaporates as separate atoms.

It is almost the opposite of how we get to almost absolute zero by adding in photons (energy) of laser created light.  When cooling, the trick is to stop the atoms vibrating by hitting them with a equal and opposite amount of energy.  Works well, they they are down to the past picokelvin.

Worth noting that temperature is the mean free path speed of the atom or molecule.  Some will be faster (hotter) and some will be slower (colder).  If you can knock the faster ones away, you actually lower the remaining average speed (temperature) of the sample.

This is what Maxwell thought up with his Daemon while thinking about thermodynamics.

 

(I miss studying thermodynamics, it is the basis of traditional physics, only ruined by all this quantum malarkey.

[Post and beam]

The point i was trying to make is that a lot of the apparent increase in atmospheric water may not be down to the rise in Global temperature that is commonly given as the reason.

[SteamyTea]

1 hour ago, Post and beam said:

The point i was trying to make is that a lot of the apparent increase in atmospheric water may not be down to the rise in Global temperature that is commonly given as the reason.

You are probably right, to a certain extent, air pressure, wave and bubble size will have an impact as well.

But they are probably more effected (or us it affected) by temperature more than anything else.

 

If you put more energy into a system, eventually it goes bang. Just depends if it is a normal bang, or an extraordinary bang.

[Post and beam]

18 hours ago, SteamyTea said:

can easily knock at electron free from a molecule

This is ionising Radiation which is a whole different kettle of fish.

[SteamyTea]

7 minutes ago, Post and beam said:

This is ionising Radiation which is a whole different kettle of fish.

Yes, should have explained it a bit more.

There will still be some molecular breakup though.

[Post and beam]

Breaking the bond between the Hydrogen and Oxygen i can see. Leaving them to recombine to form the water that will fall as rain somewhere.

On 06/03/2024 at 11:07, Originaltwist said:

England obvs.

 

But ionising either of the constituents  will do a different thing will it not?

[SteamyTea]

1 hour ago, Post and beam said:

Breaking the bond between the Hydrogen and Oxygen i can see. Leaving them to recombine to form the water that will fall as rain somewhere.

Not all of them will recombine to water, some will make nails rust, and some will become hydrocarbons.

1 hour ago, Post and beam said:

But ionising either of the constituents  will do a different thing will it not

The way I understand it is that not every excited electron will release an ionising photon (high energy). Most will just fall back to a lower energy state, creating a very tiny rise in temperature.  If it was not so, all shiny things would kill us.

I think most ionising takes place as protons (and neutrons) decay, changing the high number elements to lower number ones i.e. uranium to lead.

 

[Omnibuswoman]

I am very seriously concerned about rising sea temperatures and the impact on the strength and frequency of storms across the UK, especially in the South West. We asked our structural engineer to spec to withstand hurricane force winds, and got a rather sceptical look. I also over specced the drainage system as I’m concerned that 1:100 year storms will become much more frequent. 
 

Sadly the government seem hell-bent on demonising people who are worried about the climate, rather than recognizing the need to inform/educate and prepare our society for what is likely to unfold over the next 30 years. 

[SteamyTea]

25 minutes ago, Omnibuswoman said:

. I also over specced the drainage system as I’m concerned that 1:100 year storms will become much more frequent

I don't remember the precise predictions, but 1:100 storms have become something like 1:30 storms.

Most of Cornwall is going to cope reasonably well with storms, there will always be the odd ones like Boscastle 2004, but that really was a quirk of topology.

Storm surges are probably the biggest threat down here, but they tend to take out carparks and amusement arcades.

The Wherrytown storm of 1962 is an interesting example, the sea defence has lasted well. New types of material are currently being tested there at the moment.