Are all metal stud wall systems created equally?

[Tony K]

I am weighing up the prices of various metal partition wall systems. Knauf and Siniat are the better-known options it seems and have good instructional videos, but a make called Arrow comes up noticeably cheaper.

The thickness of the sections is the same (0.55mm) in each instance, as are the principles of how to install etc. 

 

I note that the Knauf system is described as 'Galvanised Steel' (at least on the Wickes website), whereas the Arrow one is not.

 

Does anyone have nay experience of these systems, and if so is there a noticeable difference in quality between them?

 

Thanks

[nod]

Yes I use most systems Mainly BG Only because some contracts specify it Same with deep head track Some jobs do and some jobs don’t 

BG I’d heavier gauge But they all look and perform the same once finished 

Arrowa a good choice About a third saving on BG

[Tony K]

Thanks @nod.

 

Am I right to think I can mix and match between different makes, so long as the sizings are the same?

[nod]

Yes you can Tony 

 

Have a look at G tech 

Good product Good price 

[Tony K]

45 minutes ago, nod said:

Have a look at G tech 

Good product Good price 

 

Cheers @nod I will. 

[nod]

15 hours ago, Tony K said:

 

Cheers @nod I will. 

No probs 

Drop me a message if you get stuck with anything 

[Tony K]

Since creating this thread I have now built all the metal stud walls, plus one wall from timber, and half-boarded the lot ahead of first-fix services. 

 

My experience, which may help others considering whether to use metal or timber studs has been that the metal stud system is easy to install (even though I'm working alone) and a bit more forgiving than timber. It's quite quick therefore. 

 

One big problem has been trying to screw plasterboard to the metal 'C' studs. Far too often the tip of the screw passes through the plasterboard, meets the metal stud but then, rather than penetrating into the stud, pushes it away. This will often damage the plasterboard, and is extremely frustrating.

 

Once the first screw is in properly the metal stud tends to stay still thereafter, but I have needed someone to go to the other side and push the side part of the stud up against the plasterboard to hold it still while I drill. That is possible when fixing the first side of plasterboards in place as you can still access the studs, but will not be possible when I close off the walls. 

 

Is there a solution to this?!

 

Cheers 

[Dave Jones]

tru stud.

 

Think of your carbon footprint using metal.

[crispy_wafer]

5 hours ago, Tony K said:

Since creating this thread I have now built all the metal stud walls, plus one wall from timber, and half-boarded the lot ahead of first-fix services. 

 

My experience, which may help others considering whether to use metal or timber studs has been that the metal stud system is easy to install (even though I'm working alone) and a bit more forgiving than timber. It's quite quick therefore. 

 

One big problem has been trying to screw plasterboard to the metal 'C' studs. Far too often the tip of the screw passes through the plasterboard, meets the metal stud but then, rather than penetrating into the stud, pushes it away. This will often damage the plasterboard, and is extremely frustrating.

 

Once the first screw is in properly the metal stud tends to stay still thereafter, but I have needed someone to go to the other side and push the side part of the stud up against the plasterboard to hold it still while I drill. That is possible when fixing the first side of plasterboards in place as you can still access the studs, but will not be possible when I close off the walls. 

 

Is there a solution to this?!

 

Cheers 

 

I've taken to putting C studs back to back - like ][ , because I had some left over, and it was easier for me to use rather than sell on.  Makes it loads more rigid!  I wouldn't buy more to do this though, it was just a try it and see thing.

 

 

 

[saveasteading]

Noticing your original question  there are some quality differences between brands. 

Knauf and BG are the normal brands. 

I don't know Arrowa so no comment.

There used to be an unbranded product at CCF which was a lot cheaper.

Then there is a much stiffer system (name escapes me) due to being made with ripples in the metal.

And Lindab have one that clips into self and head tracks, saving time and easier for one person, but costs accordingly.

 

My rule of thumb was to use timber for normal ceiling heights, and steel stud from 2.4m to 6m, based on cost.

[MortarThePoint]

15 hours ago, Tony K said:

One big problem has been trying to screw plasterboard to the metal 'C' studs. Far too often the tip of the screw passes through the plasterboard, meets the metal stud but then, rather than penetrating into the stud, pushes it away. This will often damage the plasterboard, and is extremely frustrating.

 

I don't think it's commonly talked about, but C-studs have a direction you should assemble in. You should screw the side with the web first as it is stiffer than the other open side.

 

If you're on your own and struggling, you could always drill a pilot hole for the first screw.

 

I use self drilling buggle head screws. Screws must be fine pitch for MF.

[Tony K]

On 16/05/2023 at 07:21, MortarThePoint said:

 

I don't think it's commonly talked about, but C-studs have a direction you should assemble in. You should screw the side with the web first as it is stiffer than the other open side.

 

If you're on your own and struggling, you could always drill a pilot hole for the first screw.

 

I use self drilling buggle head screws. Screws must be fine pitch for MF.

 

Thanks.

I can't see any difference between the two sides of the MF studs that I've got. Wouldn't I just run into the same problem in the end either way though? The issue is not that the studs are sliding left and right inside the ceiling and floor channels. They are staying still but just bending away when the screw comes into contact with them.

 

I have been using standard drywall plasterboard screws (the black ones). Do you use something like these:

 

https://whiterosetools.com/products/timco-drywall-screws-self-drilling-tapping-screw-countersunk-bugle-head-zinc-phillips?utm_source=google.com&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=Google+SF+PMax&variant=42448585294018&sfdr_ptcid=20300_100_692063436&sfdr_hash=a02cc0be0789231c2d233329db42e7a2&gclid=CjwKCAjw04yjBhApEiwAJcvNoRNr3teWlDOHc0vbvwPAAqL7McS08e8MZC4cQxx_MsxAhOwnUviqYhoCDzgQAvD_BwE

 

Cheers!

 

[saveasteading]

If you aim the screw as near to the web as possible, it won't deflect much. I've had loads of the stuff fitted and nobody ever moaned about this as a problem, so I guess it is just practice. I tried it and had the same issue as you.

[Tony K]

1 hour ago, saveasteading said:

If you aim the screw as near to the web as possible, it won't deflect much. I've had loads of the stuff fitted and nobody ever moaned about this as a problem, so I guess it is just practice. I tried it and had the same issue as you.

 

Damn it.

It's always a problem when I have to rely on skill....!

 

[saveasteading]

53 minutes ago, Tony K said:

rely on skill.

The people who do drywall only do drywall....every day. 

Stud and board and walk away. Same next day. 1000s of screws. 

I noticed they go through a lot of posi heads, so that must be significant, somehow. 

[Tony K]

2 hours ago, saveasteading said:

The people who do drywall only do drywall....every day. 

Stud and board and walk away. Same next day. 1000s of screws. 

I noticed they go through a lot of posi heads, so that must be significant, somehow. 

 

Yeah, that's a good point and something others can learn from if considering undertaking the task themselves.

Based on my experience, MF stud walling and boarding yourself can be done, and to a reasonable enough standard (he says), but it has taken me ages to do.

Partly that is working alone, but partly it is inexperience and inefficiency on my part compared to a tradesman. 

[Wil]

Would it work to put a chock of wood in between the webs of the C section for the first screw only so that it doesn’t deflect inwards?

 

Don’t know how you’d hold it there unless you put it in with a temp screw from the other side first… unless you start at the bottom. 

 

I’ve watched miles of the stuff go in, but most pro’s tend to use the speed guns so smash smash smash, done.

[Tony K]

11 minutes ago, Wil said:

Would it work to put a chock of wood in between the webs of the C section for the first screw only so that it doesn’t deflect inwards?

 

Don’t know how you’d hold it there unless you put it in with a temp screw from the other side first… unless you start at the bottom. 

 

I’ve watched miles of the stuff go in, but most pro’s tend to use the speed guns so smash smash smash, done.

 

I have thought about that, but the chock of wood would need to be cut to shape to fit inside the slight lip on either side of the mouth of the C stud, plus I'd need a lot of them (one for every stud). 

 

I have also thought about hiring a speed gun or maybe a nail gun, but I'm not sure why either would address the tendency of the stud to deflect inwards. 

 

I should think I will end up doing it slowly, cursing a lot, and making a few unnecessary scuffs in the boards.

 

Initiating though as there must be a way that pros avoid the problem. As others have said, perhaps a combination of skill, different tools, a second set of hands, different screws, etc.

 

Of the above, I will try different screws and see how I get on.