Creosote posts

[Russell griffiths]

This is a bit irrelevant to house building but I always find some very informative answers on here so I thought I'd have an ask. 

Fence posts treated with creosote the good old fashioned cold tar stuff , would anybody know if there is a rule as to how close they can be used next to a waterbody, lake to be precise. 

I know that the creosote is harmful to the aquatic environment but where can I find out how close I can bang a post in the ground near the lake. 

I have 355 posts to put in and to be told afterwards by the ea that I have to change them would be painful. 

Just as an offshoot a large section of the lakebank was unsuccessfuly shored up with the use of railway sleepers around 30 years ago this certainly doesn't seem to have harmed anything. The nearest post to the lake will be aprox 20m away. 

Cheers russ. 

[PeterW]

The regs are in the EU Directive Annex but as long as you are using them professionally and not as a consumer then you can use creosote treated products anywhere on the list with the exception of children's play parks etc . The rules even include them being used in waterways and harbours 

 

 

[Temp]

3 hours ago, Russell griffiths said:

I have 355 posts to put in and to be told afterwards by the ea that I have to change them would be painful. 

 

I didn't know you could still buy posts treated with creosote? Its disappeared from all retail shops and most of the online sellers have "substitute" somewhere in small print.

 

https://www.creosotesales.co.uk/

 

In July 2003, it became an offence for the general public to purchase and apply Coal Tar Creosote. However, the product is still available for sale to trades-people.

[Russell griffiths]

Just now, Temp said:

 

I didn't know you could still buy posts treated with creosote? Its disappeared from all retail shops and most of the online sellers have "substitute" somewhere in small print.

 

https://www.creosotesales.co.uk/

 

 

 

Still readily available your not allowed to buy them as a householder. 

No problem for agriculture or as a contractor. 

So I can buy them and use them on your land, but you can't buy them and use yourself. 

Beggers belief really the rules we have to deal with. 

I use them regularly but didn't know where to find the regulations for near a water course. 

I have a neighbour who wants me to do a job for him but is scared the ea will come and tell us off. 

[Temp]

Thought I'd try and find the regs...

 

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2003/1511/regulation/4/made

 

Seems it can be used in limited situations..

(a)for wood treatment in industrial installations; and

(b)for in situ retreatment of wood for industrial or professional use by professionals covered by European Community legislation on the protection of workers

Para b is unclear.  I can read it several ways.  Looks to me like the retreated wood must be for industrial or professional use (eg not garden use). 

[Onoff]

Cut the creosote 50/50 with old engine oil for a really environmentally friendly solution!

[Russell griffiths]

56 minutes ago, Onoff said:

Cut the creosote 50/50 with old engine oil for a really environmentally friendly solution!

Or a drop of red diesel. 

[Ferdinand]

You cannot leave it exposed where the public esp. children can be in contact with it.

 

I interpret that as the above ground section of posts in garden fences are not ok, though e.g. those supporting a closed deck might be OK.

[Jeremy Harris]

11 hours ago, Ferdinand said:

You cannot leave it exposed where the public esp. children can be in contact with it.

 

I interpret that as the above ground section of posts in garden fences are not ok, though e.g. those supporting a closed deck might be OK.

 

All telephone and power poles are liberally soaked with the stuff.  We have two new ones, both on the side of the lane where children can lean on them, touch them etc.  SSE told me that I could not remove and dispose of the old pole they left up on our site for nearly a year because it was "hazardous waste".  I asked them to remove it (and had already paid them to do this as a part of the job of relocating their cable underground) yet they kept delaying and delaying.  In the end I slipped an Openreach Polecat team a tenner to lift the old SSE pole out and position it on the bank that forms our verge, where I staked it in place as an "erosion protector" (it's really there to bounce big tractors back into the lane and stop them damaging the bank).

Edited April 20, 2017 by JSHarris

[Onoff]

8 minutes ago, JSHarris said:

 

All telephone and power poles are liberally soaked with the stuff.  We have two new ones, both on the side of the lane where children can lean on them, touch them etc.

 

"Mummy this tree burns!"

[Ferdinand]

33 minutes ago, JSHarris said:

 

All telephone and power poles are liberally soaked with the stuff.  We have two new ones, both on the side of the lane where children can lean on them, touch them etc.  SSE told me that I could not remove and dispose of the old pole they left up on our site for nearly a year because it was "hazardous waste".  I asked them to remove it (and had already paid them to do this as a part of the job of relocating their cable underground) yet they kept delaying and delaying.  In the end I slipped an Openreach Polecat team a tenner to lift the old SSE pole out and position it on the bank that forms our verge, where I staked it in place as an "erosion protector" (it's really there to bounce big tractors back into the lane and stop them damaging the bank).

 

I think I see a material difference between 'side of the road' and 'back garden', as implied imo by 3 point 4 in @PeterW in his attachment.

 

F

[Jeremy Harris]

It depends on the nature of the road.  In our case the posts are along the side of a very quiet (maybe a dozen vehicles a day, if that) lane, where kids regularly play on skateboards etc.  The lane is so narrow that pedestrians have to climb part-way up the banks to allow vehicles to pass.  Grabbing a convenient pole is a good way to keep balance!