Hi new member need advise on oil fired central heating system.

[mike2020]

Hiya just bought a cottage in a semi rural location its off the gas mains grid, already has oil fired heating system don't know anything about them but believe they are a lott more economical than electric.

Was thinking of also putting an oil fired aga type range in the kitchen, looking to buy a used aga type range.

I was hoping some kind person could let me know if its the right way to go economy wise,Looking to move the boiler and replace with the aga in the same position but keep the boiler and just move to another position in the house.

I know you can get aga's that run the heating also but money is tight at this moment  and maybe the cost of hooking the aga up to a heating system is costly or maybe not: will include a link with the house brochure and you will see the pictures of current boiler. Also any advice on putting the tank underground.

https://www.peterdavid.co.uk/property/residential/for-sale/west-yorkshire/halifax/luddendenfoot/30811201

 

p.s. cottage was built in 1781 was originally two cottages converted into one, we will be doing a total renovation.

Thank you in advance for any advice greatly appreciated.

 

[Coops]

Hi Mike, congratulations on the new purchase, looks like a great project. I bet you had to really fight for that, given the way the market is right now?! Should be tons of period features once you strip it all back. 

 

I've looked into AGAs as well, seemed the natural lifestyle choice for the old farmhouse we are restoring, but once you look into the detail they are both horrifically expensive to purchase and to run. Some of them like Everhot based in Derby do have independently controlled electric ovens which helps, but it's literally nuts to consider any of the these on a budget. My advice would be to slot a range type cooker in that chimney breast to fill up the space and re site your current boiler somewhere more suitable, maybe even go with an insulated external enclosure. 

 

If you intend to replace the heating system as part of the refurbishment program, it might pay to consider ASHP options and make use of the renewable heating incentive which can offset some of the cost. You probably already know that this system is ideal if you can squeeze in underfloor heating in but if not viable it can still work with big bore plumbing/radiators. Oil still pretty cheap though at the moment so unless you're self building, no huge rush to renewables just yet. 

 

Cheers 

[Coops]

https://www.fueltankshop.co.uk/heating-oil/underground-oil-tanks/c359

[markc]

Aga is great if you are always around the house and constantly putting stuff into the ovens - amazing baked potatoes and slow cooked dishes, but they are very expensive to run if you are often away from the property. They are always burning, take days to warm up or cool down and you have to think about and plan meals in advance.

[SteamyTea]

17 minutes ago, markc said:

take days to warm up or cool down

Cast iron has a SHC of 0.46 kJ/kg.°C

Water has a SHC of 4.18 kJ/kg.°C

So it takes almost 10 times as long for any particular heat input i.e. 10 kW, to heat water.

Same for cooling down.

[Gone West]

9 hours ago, mike2020 said:

Was thinking of also putting an oil fired aga type range in the kitchen, looking to buy a used aga type range.

We have just moved into an old stone walled cottage that has an oil fired AGA Redfyre cooker that does the CH and DHW. It's about twelve years old and we are going to have it taken out and replaced with an external oil fired boiler. We are removing it because we don't use the ovens and it's bulky and noisy as all oil boilers are. Have you lived with an indoor oil boiler through the winter.

[Coops]

2 hours ago, markc said:

Aga is great if you are always around the house and constantly putting stuff into the ovens - amazing baked potatoes and slow cooked dishes, but they are very expensive to run if you are often away from the property. They are always burning, take days to warm up or cool down and you have to think about and plan meals in advance.

Exactly, AGA/Rayburn etc. are the quintessential farmers choice for good reason, makes complete sense if the environment is right, like a working farm, but for the rest of us there is no practical argument for them at all, just a very very uneconomical fashion statement. Much cheaper to buy a couple of Spaniels and an expensive pair of Chameau wellies if you want to cultivate the country look. 

 

[mike2020]

Hi and thanks for the comments 'everyone'...... coops forgetting the aga now we will put in an electric range cooker  economy wise seems the best way to go, we will be replacing the boiler as it's not a combi the is a walled knook at the end of the kitchen not shown in pics where we think it will fit fine aprox 7ft by 5ft would be better suited outside by everyones comments but as its currently are only outside space plan to yorkstone the whole front later on.

 

For sure we will put underground tank in also seems the best way to go. We got a great deal on the house not much over asking price as we had sold our house and where in the position to move right away.

 

The house has been empty for 2 yrs and only put on the market recently.

 

 

 

 

[mike2020]

P.S.  ASHP from what ive read on other threads not suited for this type of house D efc rating.

[Coops]

12 minutes ago, mike2020 said:

P.S.  ASHP from what ive read on other threads not suited for this type of house D efc rating.

No not ideal, but possible with a lot of insulation, problem is to create the voids required to insulate the correct level you'll end up making it look like a new build so a bit counter productive. It's why I dropped renewables quite quickly and stayed with oil. 

[IanR]

20 minutes ago, mike2020 said:

P.S.  ASHP from what ive read on other threads not suited for this type of house D efc rating.

 

It's not really as simple as that. At current pricing electricity is around 3.5 or 4 times the kWh cost of Gas.

 

Gas boilers are up to 90% efficient, so if you are going to use (renewable) electricity to heat your home, you need an electric heater that is 350% to 450% efficient (averaged throughout the year), for it to have the same day-to-day running costs.

With a heat pump, it is possible to achieve and exceed this.

If you don't have access to gas, then the comparison to electricity is much more favourable, as you have to spend much more on every kWh of energy you purchase in the form of oil or LPG

 

A heat pump is more efficient with a low flow temp, so larger heat emitters (UFH and large rads) and a large water cylinder, allow flow temperatures to be reduced.

The lower SAP score suggests a higher energy loss due lower levels of insulation and/or poorer air-tightness. This means that proportionally larger heat emitters would be required to achieve the same low flow temperature. For UFH that would mean closer spacing of the loops, or for radiators, even larger ones.

 

Undoubtedly a heating system can be more easily designed for low flow temperatures with a house that has a better EPC score, but that doesn't mean they can't work in a house that doesn't.

 

The capital cost is a different matter. If you are not already planning a renovation then the cost of changing heat emitters to UFH and/or large radiators to accommodate a heat pump has to be considered. 

 

And if you are planning a renovation, insulation and air-tightness should be high on your list, so however you are heating your home you need to buy less kWh of the energy required.

[Gone West]

46 minutes ago, mike2020 said:

ASHP from what ive read on other threads not suited for this type of house D efc rating.

Not really without a lot of work improving the insulation levels and increasing the size of the radiators to compensate for the lower water temperature. Saying that, there are oil/ASHP hybrids which use the ASHP for most of the time and have the oil kicking in when higher temperatures are needed.

[mike2020]

I will for sure improve insulation as much as possible but the capital outlay on ASHP i think would be restrictive, the wife wanted to use existing yorkstone fllors but when i told her the cost of the heat loss she soon changed her mind. (ground floor)plans are to tile the kitchen in aged slate matt finish tiles and to carpet the living room with insulating thermal underlay.

 

From what i have read and please correct me if iam wrong you would have to pull them up to lay insulation beneath then reset the stones.

 

Really would like to keep the building as authentic as possible but budget will also dictate dont want to give it a new build look and feel, If anyone has any recommendations on what kind of windows and insulation i should use great,no cavity walls  unfortunately.