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Automated UFH


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Most manifolds, the pin is spring loaded and with nothing attached the pin is up and the flow is ON

 

Most actuators push down on the pin and thus shut the water OFF when not energised.

 

When you energise an actuator it's pad retracts, allowing the pin to push up under it's spring tension and turn the flow ON

 

did you buy these 2 core actuators as something special e.g normally closed or normally open?

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5 minutes ago, ProDave said:

Most manifolds, the pin is spring loaded and with nothing attached the pin is up and the flow is ON

 

Most actuators push down on the pin and thus shut the water OFF when not energised.

 

When you energise an actuator it's pad retracts, allowing the pin to push up under it's spring tension and turn the flow ON

 

did you buy these 2 core actuators as something special e.g normally closed or normally open?

Not sure 

 

https://www.wundatrade.co.uk/shop/home/quick-shop/wundatherm-quick-shop/controls-quickshop/actuator-auto-balancing/

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20 minutes ago, Gav_P said:

I wunda (ha ha see what I did there ?) if the auto balancing bit is doing something clever with the 7 degree delta that it’s supposed to maintain? 

Maybe . But I’m still confused ! ( not hard to do ) . It would seem actuator powered is zone off I.e pin down . But in that case pump should be off .

or 

 

I’ve got this all wrong ( ? ) . Ignoring the clever delta stuff - power to actuator means zone on or off ....??

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18 minutes ago, pocster said:

Maybe . But I’m still confused ! ( not hard to do ) . It would seem actuator powered is zone off I.e pin down . But in that case pump should be off .

or 

 

I’ve got this all wrong ( ? ) . Ignoring the clever delta stuff - power to actuator means zone on or off ....??

Power on should be zone on and pump on. 

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5 minutes ago, JFDIY said:

Don't they come with the pin retracted for easy fitting. When powered up it releases then does the calibration exercise

640079203_Screenshot_20210116-2006022.thumb.png.67ea0f4e22c8bf24de29fbf016a89f00.png

 

 

 

Screenshot_20210116-200602.png

Yeah I think so . Did search the forum and found some other threads on the issue . Will experiment next week ?

It was just strange that the return / flow on that zone were cold after a few hours - even though actuator was on .

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Reading through old threads on all this and blending valves - naturally confusing myself .

Understand the suggested requirement for a blending valve as to stop water to hot ( due to boiler /ASHP etc . failure ) entering the ufh .

’puts neck under blade ‘ . With these self regulating actuators and the delta being greater than 7/4 degrees - the actuator would shut - preventing potentially damaging the slab due to over heating .

Erm , ( hides behind sofa ) - that’s correct yes ? ??

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3 minutes ago, pocster said:

With these self regulating actuators and the delta being greater than 7/4 degrees - the actuator would shut - preventing potentially damaging the slab due to over heating .

Erm , ( hides behind sofa ) - that’s correct yes ?


No because when they are “on” they don’t fully close, they partially close to restrict flow. Think there is a minimum flow with them. 

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6 minutes ago, PeterW said:


No because when they are “on” they don’t fully close, they partially close to restrict flow. Think there is a minimum flow with them. 

Ah right ! Assumed closed was closed .

Now you’ve concerned me I’m tempted to stick my own sensor on flow and return . I can then shut the manifold pump and actuators automatically if flow temp is too high . That sounds sensible ? . My uvc ufh output is set at the minimum I think of 30 degrees . So if I auto shut off everything if flow exceeds 35 degrees - it would be a good fail safe ?

Edited by pocster
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What’s the worst that could happen..?? It will fail and flood your basement with warm water so it becomes a swimming pool .... 

 

I don’t think you will get the linear flow you expect without a blending valve tbh, and your ASHP cycling will pulse the heat in and it will give you issues - for the sake of a £30 blending valve why not fit one ..??

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Just now, PeterW said:

What’s the worst that could happen..?? It will fail and flood your basement with warm water so it becomes a swimming pool .... 

 

I don’t think you will get the linear flow you expect without a blending valve tbh, and your ASHP cycling will pulse the heat in and it will give you issues - for the sake of a £30 blending valve why not fit one ..??

Because the installer ( whom was recommended on here many times ) didn’t see the point of it . 

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Try the re-calibration procedure, sounds like something went wrong when you first switched it on. You have to have stable or rising temperature on the hot side of manifold. Also if your floor was warm to start with it will have possibly fooled it with calculating the flow direction as water in return side was already hot.

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1 hour ago, JFDIY said:

Try the re-calibration procedure, sounds like something went wrong when you first switched it on. You have to have stable or rising temperature on the hot side of manifold. Also if your floor was warm to start with it will have possibly fooled it with calculating the flow direction as water in return side was already hot.

You might be right . Started it from all cold today and set re calibrate. Bathroom floor starting to warm up . Two temp sensors in bathroom ; one at 10.4 other at 11.3 . Floor doesn’t feel cold to the touch now .

Edited by pocster
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Is the rest of the house sapping the heat?

 

I had issues with one of those actuators trying to get it to calibrate, the floor was always warm. In the end I loosened the body about one turn, did the calibration, then once completed tightened it back down on the manifold. Been fine since, I did email salus but never got a reply.

 

I'd try running the calibration exercise a few times as I'm sure they get better each time.

 

Failing that You could try the opposite of my bodge, but you'd need to just slacken the actuator to allow the pin to come up more after calibration to prove it. 

 

 

 

then contact wunda or salus to check if it's a common issue

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1 hour ago, pocster said:

Well 24hrs just the bathroom has been on and it’s gone from 10 degrees to 13.5 

Ive got the ASHP on the lowest setting . Rather have it run efficiently than heat quicker . But does that sound correct??

What is this "lowest setting"? do you mean you have the water temperature turned right down?  What is the water temperature set to?

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8 minutes ago, JFDIY said:

Is the rest of the house sapping the heat?

 

I had issues with one of those actuators trying to get it to calibrate, the floor was always warm. In the end I loosened the body about one turn, did the calibration, then once completed tightened it back down on the manifold. Been fine since, I did email salus but never got a reply.

 

I'd try running the calibration exercise a few times as I'm sure they get better each time.

 

Failing that You could try the opposite of my bodge, but you'd need to just slacken the actuator to allow the pin to come up more after calibration to prove it. 

 

 

 

then contact wunda or salus to check if it's a common issue

Rest of house has zero heating so it’s highly possible the heat is just leaving the bathroom ( no doors anywhere ) and just heating the entire build . I’ll leave it another 24 hours 

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1 minute ago, pocster said:

Rest of house has zero heating so it’s highly possible the heat is just leaving the bathroom ( no doors anywhere ) and just heating the entire build . I’ll leave it another 24 hours 

Very likely.

 

For a long time early in the build we had cardboard doors on most of the rooms.

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