Ed Davies Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 16 minutes ago, newhome said: It’s the sort of info that if you were properly trained you should know IMO as how many people will look things up mid install? I couldn't disagree more. Trying to remember arbitrary numbers is a waste of brain power and very unreliable; they should be looking things up on site and starting by doing so for the exam is probably a useful part of the training. It's what the On Site Guide exists for, for the common cases. Airline pilots have only a few very short checklists they're required to remember (engine failure on take off procedures and other actions which need to be done quickly); everything else is done from the book (or tablet nowadays). Similarly, there's been a bit of backlash in programming about expecting people to know details of libraries (e.g., in interviews) when in practice programmers look things up all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Harris Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 I don't have a problem with anyone having to look up a number quickly, the problem comes when you have supposedly competent people who don't, because they haven't had the experience and training to understand that they need to. A good example is cable derating factors. We recently had an EICR done on our old house, and the chap doing it failed to note (despite having been up in the loft and lifted the insulation to check the cables) that the majority of the cables up there were now installed to reference method 101, not reference method 3 as he put on the chit. I spotted it and corrected him, and it wasn't significant given that the power ring finals are fused at 30 A, but it would have been an unsatisfactory if the electric shower was still connected to the unused and disconnected length of 6mm² T&E up there, as that cable would have been under-rated for the load for 101, but OK for reference method C (for reference method C, 6mm² T&E is rated at 46 A, or 10.58 kW at 230 VAC, whereas for reference method 101 the rating drops down to 27 A, or 6.21 kW at 230 VAC). The key is having the experience and knowledge to understand that you need to dig into the book to find the relevant numbers to apply. I got the distinct impression that the chap who was doing this work had just memorised the reference method C ratings and applied them everywhere, without considering the implications of cables under 250mm of insulation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 1 hour ago, newhome said: I don’t feel that people should be able to look things up in a test such as the ones in the link. It’s the sort of info that if you were properly trained you should know IMO as how many people will look things up mid install? You either know this stuff or you don’t. And knowing that you’re taking a test surely you’ve been revising too? You don’t get to take the Highway Code into the driving theory test. The information is near infinite. Take a look at the 18th book, and if you can memorise that you get a gold star off me The Highway Code is a wee little booklet by comparison. The purpose of the book is to demonstrate that you can find the answers in order to arrive at the correct conclusion. It’s the reason that astronauts still have a few manuals on board the shuttle eg there’s too much info and not enough grey matter. They’re also just electricians not brain surgeons so as the stakes are different so are the guidelines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 I used to take the regs to bed to read, like a novel. Fascinating tbh. Not much of a plot mind! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterW Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 1 hour ago, Ed Davies said: Similarly, there's been a bit of backlash in programming about expecting people to know details of libraries (e.g., in interviews) when in practice programmers look things up all the time. Wish a few of the ones I’ve had work for me recently had bothered to do a bit of reading rather than rely on doing in “the way they have always done it...” There are dinosaurs in every industry and I’d rather someone look something up than rely on memory ..! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 This forum is all about defeating, and hopefully educating the dinosaurs. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted December 4, 2018 Share Posted December 4, 2018 (edited) Another 18th edition test paper here (answers on the last page). I've had to scrub out all the pen marks ticking the answers and redo the a,b,c,d. I've a second paper I'll do sometime. 2382-18_paper1.pdf Edited December 5, 2018 by Onoff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 Well that's the 18th passed today. Now if I could only blow my own trumpet... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newhome Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 20 minutes ago, Onoff said: Well that's the 18th passed today. Now if I could only blow my own trumpet... Thought you were certified already ? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 19 minutes ago, newhome said: Thought you were certified already ? Should be! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 I REALLY need to start revising my NAPIT. Just need there to be about 27 hours in a day to free up some time ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 15 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said: I REALLY need to start revising my NAPIT. Just need there to be about 27 hours in a day to free up some time ? I found it helpful to lay off the drink for 24hrs... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 8 minutes ago, Onoff said: I found it helpful to lay off the drink for 24hrs... I just spat mine out after reading that ??? You get a Blue Peter PissHead badge for that. My sides are still hurting. Nutter.? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 The lecturer taking us for the 18th was a dour Yorkshireman. He kept on about the prices of things (beer etc) "down South". He was pretty good and could spout the regulations off the top off of his head so we were hanging on his every word and dutifully making notes. He then recounted how a lad on a previous course was talking to him about kitchens and how this guy said his had cost £140K. Incredulous at the cost even for "down South", he said: "By Christ, how big is your house?" "Just a 3 bed semi" the chap said. Still reeling the lecturer pressed on and asked how in the Hell a kitchen in a 3 bed semi could cost that much. "Well, the missus ran off with the kitchen fitter!" 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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