Newly fitted dry ridge system

[Mr Punter]

So has that ridge tile you showed in the pictures with the big gaps been sorted?

[BobAJob]

25 minutes ago, Mr Punter said:

So has that ridge tile you showed in the pictures with the big gaps been sorted?

Yes

[BobAJob]

1 hour ago, BobAJob said:

Yes

Although the roofer told me it was absolutely fine and all his other customers who be happy with it.  Now I don't trust a word he says. 

[BobAJob]

Had the roof checked by another roofer today and he discovered:

 

1. The valleys were all rough and a bit cracked.  He said if someone did that on a building they'd told to go home.

 

2. The first roofer had forgotten to take the backing off the glued sections of the dry ridge material over a 14 metre section, so it wasn't stuck to the roof at all. 

 

3. One section of the dry ridge has large gaps in so need to reposition the tiles to tighten it up. 

 

So I'm thinking I'm not going to pay the original roofer his full price.  Not paying for the valleys at all.  

[joe90]

Did your new roofer put this in writing?, if he did you could use it to explain why your not paying full price.

[BobAJob]

5 minutes ago, joe90 said:

Did your new roofer put this in writing?, if he did you could use it to explain why your not paying full price.

No, because apparently the original roofer is well known in the area as being a nasty man and has been known to turn up at people's doors with his men.  The new roofer tells me that he often has to redo work that the original roofer has done.  

 

You'd think it was pretty easy to remember you have to peel off the protective backing paper on the glued section of the dry ridge material before you stick it to the roof.  The new roofer peeled a 14m long strip of backing paper off the glued section. I stood there and saw him do it.  Doh!!

[Vijay]

I think the law is you need to give the first roofer a chance to put it right? last thing you want/need is him taking you to court. So the angle I'd imagine you need to take is being perceived to give him a chance, but maybe give him so much work to put right that he doesn't want to come back

[Big Jimbo]

Give the local drug dealer £100. He can get one of the local smack heads to go and baseball bat the roofers legs. That way he won't be able to go onto other peoples roof and do poor work for a few months. Think of it as providing a service to the locals........NO, i'm only kidding, as he said, you do sound like a pain in the butt.....Only kidding. I think i would get the 1st roofers bill. Lets say £1000. Get the bill from the second roofer who you have used to put it right. Lets say £500. Ask the first roofer to pop round to get his money.  Give him the £500. Tell him you have had to spend £500 on getting his work put right. He he want's any more money he will have to sue you. That way you are being fair in my opinion. Finally, learn your mistake. Stop using those crappy internet sites to find trade people.....If they are any good, they don't go anywhere near those. 

[BobAJob]

23 minutes ago, Vijay said:

I think the law is you need to give the first roofer a chance to put it right? last thing you want/need is him taking you to court. So the angle I'd imagine you need to take is being perceived to give him a chance, but maybe give him so much work to put right that he doesn't want to come back

I have given two chances to get it right.  The second time he redid the work to remove the ridge tile with the massive gaps to the side.  I had him back last week and asked him to redo some mortaring and look at why the dry ridge material wasn't stuck in one place.  He told me the material didn't need to be stuck to the roof tiles.  Today the new roofer got on the roof and discovered that the reason the material wasn't stuck to the roof was because they hadn't removed the protective backing strip from the glued section along 14 metres of the roof.  He suspects it is the same on the three runs of 14 metres. 

 

The original roofer went off in a sulk after threatening me and demanding payment in cash.  It's now been almost two weeks and he hasn't been in touch so I am assuming he is not interested in fixing it.  Therefore, I am getting a quote from another roof to fix the first roofer's work. 

 

I really don't want the first roofer back because:

 

1. He doesn't know what good looks like.  I'm not a roofer but I've watched some videos on YouTube about it and I know I could do a better job of it.

 

2. He was abusive, confrontational and told me he didn't want to get into a fight about it.  Apparently, him having to come back to the property costs him money.  All we wanted was a simple job done right the first time.  We're now up to a third visit if he returns and I can't trust them not to cause damage. 

[Vijay]

have you put that/got that in writing to cover yourself?

[BobAJob]

1 hour ago, Vijay said:

have you put that/got that in writing to cover yourself?

I am awaiting the quote from the new roofer before I make my next step.  No word from the old roofer even chasing payment, so clearly he doesn't care.  I think he knows that I know his game. 

 

I can put it in writing and offer him the amount I am willing to pay him. He won't like it but then I don't like the work he has done. 

 

 

[Vijay]

It's being seen to do the right thing if it ever went to court   Such a shame that this guy is doing work like this on probably the most important part of a house

[Declan52]

If he reappears then with the new roofers bill you can show him what he will need getting paid. His original bill minus the new bill. If it's £5 then that's what it is. If it's nothing then tough. Stand your ground even if he gets angry. Just say no and walk away and if needed phone the police of the threats escalate.

[BobAJob]

I'm really sick of bad roofers. 

 

We have this latest issue, which I think we can resolve fairly easily. 

 

We also have a flat EPDM roof which was installed 2 owners and 7 years ago.  It leaks when we get heavy rain. I had a roofer from our insurance company look at it and he discovered the rubber had been cut too short so it didn't go up under the roof felt far enough, so rain from under the tiles runs down the roof and makes the rubber bow and then the water comes in.  I've had a number of roofers look at and the last one discovered that the rubber wasn't actually glued the boards on the roof.  The whole thing can be rolled back.   I spoke to the roofer who installed it, who is supposed to be firestone trained and he says it leaks because the roof felt is deteriorating.   The insurance roofer said the felt is fine.  The reasons it leaks are:

 

1. The rubber has been cut too short and not laid far enough up the pitched roof. 

 

2. There should be a barge board or other board at the end of the pitch roof to support the rubber.  Because there isn't the rubber gives which causes water to pool in the dip and when enough water has accumulated it causes the rubber to bow and pour the pooled water into the ceiling.  He also discovered a number of nail holes in the rubber which allow water in. 

 

The insurance company roofer ended up gluing patches over the nail holes and pulling the rubber as far as possible up the roof. 

 

So now I have another rubber roofer booked to rip the whole thing off and redo it including new roof boards if required. 

 

I just wish I could report these people so they no longer get work and screw up people's houses. 

[makie]

27 minutes ago, BobAJob said:

 who is supposed to be firestone trained

That means nothing really, you can do a 1 day course and claim to be trained

[BobAJob]

2 hours ago, makie said:

That means nothing really, you can do a 1 day course and claim to be trained

Yes, that is what I have learned. 

[BobAJob]

So how do you find a good roofer and know that they know what they are doing?

[makie]

2 hours ago, BobAJob said:

So how do you find a good roofer and know that they know what they are doing?

Usually word of mouth or speak to some well known builders. Go to your local merchants, they will know who to use and who to avoid.

Never trust these checkatrade sites or anything like that.

[BobAJob]

What do you think of this valley pointing work?

[Declan52]

That's not pointing. That's smoothing mortar with the back of a shovel. Not good and For the few seconds extra it would have taken to smooth that out.

[BobAJob]

New roofer has suggested ripping all the mortar pointing out and redoing them.  Both valleys. £1300 which seems expensive.  He'll also replace the 4 cracked tiles on the first valley that the previous roofer decided not to replace.  The quote also includes taking the ridge tiles at the top of the valleys off, reseating and remortaring them. 

 

I feel so disappointed and let down by the original roofer.  We hired him to redo the mortar in the valleys and clean some moss of the roof and then it turned into badly fitting a dry ridge system and not doing the valleys properly either and now I find out the roofer has a bad reputation locally and has been known to get violent.   All we wanted was a relatively simple job done and now it's a mess and will cost us more to put right. 

[makie]

1 hour ago, BobAJob said:

What do you think of this valley pointing work?

 

It's terrible, I could do that better and we don't use cement in valleys much in Scotland.
 

1 hour ago, BobAJob said:

New roofer has suggested ripping all the mortar pointing out and redoing them.  Both valleys. £1300 which seems expensive. 

 

Seems steep but would depend on where you are based, how busy the roofer is etc

 

Get 3/4 quotes and make a decision from there.

[BobAJob]

30 minutes ago, makie said:

 

It's terrible, I could do that better and we don't use cement in valleys much in Scotland.
 

 

Seems steep but would depend on where you are based, how busy the roofer is etc

 

Get 3/4 quotes and make a decision from there.

Do you think it needs ripping out?

 

The new roofer said he may have to completely rebuild the valley, which sounds expensive to me. 

[Declan52]

5 minutes ago, BobAJob said:

Do you think it needs ripping out?

 

The new roofer said he may have to completely rebuild the valley, which sounds expensive to me. 

Think he is maybe worried about what else he will find if he starts to remove mortar.

If the lead is ok, no holes and nailed with copper nails, and it's turned up properly under the tiles then it's only some sand and cement. A string line from top to bottom would have been a good idea to keep the edge straight. That's been done by eye and that person must have a squint.

The problem is the mortar is hopefully packed in enough so it will last a few years so its just a question can you live with it as it sits as long as the rain will run down the lead. Or every time you walk by will you look up and get a tad angry with yourself for not fixing it. 

[BobAJob]

18 minutes ago, Declan52 said:

Think he is maybe worried about what else he will find if he starts to remove mortar.

If the lead is ok, no holes and nailed with copper nails, and it's turned up properly under the tiles then it's only some sand and cement. A string line from top to bottom would have been a good idea to keep the edge straight. That's been done by eye and that person must have a squint.

The problem is the mortar is hopefully packed in enough so it will last a few years so its just a question can you live with it as it sits as long as the rain will run down the lead. Or every time you walk by will you look up and get a tad angry with yourself for not fixing it. 

It's not lead in the valleys.  It's some kind of thick plastic.  I think the lead was replaced many years ago.