Basic cement/ ballast Q

[Onoff]

How does the shoe prevent use of a spanner? It'd be slow, better to use a socket on a ratchet.

 

If using stainless studding, stainless washers and stainless nuts they won't rust, you cut the studding off low and use a spanner or ratchet. Something like this:

 

[zoothorn]

@Onoff ok understand that, there seems to be some room for a spanner (but enough for a drill? doesn't look like it on the 6x6 shoes). But I'd need an angle grinder to cut the bar off.. or I saw through by hand & a tiny metal saw is only thing I have/ cant see that working.

 

Before I buy these shoe things, I'm concerned about upward pressure (wind will want to lift cabin UP, & constantly too). I don't seem to have any actual fixings into the post bases with these clamps.. so I'm relying solely on squeeze/ clamped sidewards pressure.

[Onoff]

If you look at the pic of the galvanised Taurus shoe there's a hole drilled thru one face. I'd project the hole centre line around with a square and Sharpie pen. Drill thru the shoe and the wood so you've a through hole. Whack a bit of grease or zinc spray around the drilled hole in the shoe and fit a cross bolt/stud. 

 

Might be worth getting the shoes first as you might be able to get M10 studding in there. 

 

Stainless steel stud is easy enough to cut with a decent full size hacksaw + decent blade. Best is 115mm grinder and 1mm slitting disc. Finish off with a file or flap disc in the grinder.

[zoothorn]

10 minutes ago, Onoff said:

If you look at the pic of the galvanised Taurus shoe there's a hole drilled thru one face. I'd project the hole centre line around with a square and Sharpie pen. Drill thru the shoe and the wood so you've a through hole. Whack a bit of grease or zinc spray around the drilled hole in the shoe and fit a cross bolt/stud. 

 

Might be worth getting the shoes first as you might be able to get M10 studding in there. 

 

Stainless steel stud is easy enough to cut with a decent full size hacksaw + decent blade. Best is 115mm grinder and 1mm slitting disc. Finish off with a file or flap disc in the grinder.

 

Ok understood. I do have access to a grinder (chap's still here but collecting anytime). what about this resin though? is it specalist stuff, is the idea here use the bar/ nuts/ washers + resin?

[Declan52]

17 hours ago, Onoff said:

 

 

- Drill a hole

- Blow out the dust

- Pump in resin, a bit like 2 pack epoxy glue but grittier (goes in a standard mastic gun)

- Push in a threaded stud

- Let it set

- Bolt down your bracket

 

 

 

Do it like this, nice and simple.

[zoothorn]

@Declan52 so you suggest use these thunderbolts + resin?

 

I understand the method (small step by step pics I've noted) but do I just ask for "resin"? mastic gun resin? or bolt resin?

[Onoff]

17 minutes ago, zoothorn said:

 

Ok understood. I do have access to a grinder (chap's still here but collecting anytime). what about this resin though? is it specalist stuff, is the idea here use the bar/ nuts/ washers + resin?

 

It used to be specialist stuff with a special applicator gun but now you can get it in tubes that fit in a standard mastic gun. 

 

https://www.screwfix.com/p/fischer-fis-vl-300-t-vinylester-resin-300ml/3613x#product_additional_details_container

 

You drill your hole then puff out the debris (with a puffer). Half fill the hole with resin and push your stud in with a little twist. Wipe any excess off (bit of wood) if it oozes out of the hole. To protect the end of the stud from getting resin on you can wrap insulating tape around.

 

Note though that the resin is a 2 part system contained within the tube. Only when it gets pushed up the special nozzle does it get mixed by a plastic screw. If you leave in the nozzle it will set rock solid. So you drill all your holes first and have your studs ready to go. You fill a hole, put a stud in, fill the next hole and put the stud in. Keep going until done. Unscrew the nozzle, its going to set inside and be useless. Screw the resin cap on if any left. Next time you go to use you need a new nozzle. Though you aim to keep yhd studs vertical as you put them in, if a bit pi$$ed, just wind two nuts on and tap into line with a hammer.

Edited September 17, 2019 by Onoff

[zoothorn]

@Onoff ok so if I use 8mm bar (I dont have a 10mm masonry bit for m10) forgive me but what size hole to drill, if I'm filling with resin?

 

I'll have to use the bar rod stuff if I use the resin.. its getting costly these 2 shoes & fixing them if thunderbolts used too @ over £50.

 

Before I put brackets on Ive got to establish exactly where to put them. This is determined by the wood guage & design of the square (I cant cope with doing the side overhang bit- its too complicated for me) base above it, to coincide with the 2.3m square walls (@ their outer points).

 

I cannot believe how complicated this is- I feel totally snowed under. Right, so if I'm just doing a square base 1) how do the beams attatch to the posts 2) exactly what dim should I go for 2.2, 2.3, 2.4?

 

Once Ive got this square base I think it'll get easier- but I'm really stressed thinking how I'm going to manage to do this square.

[zoothorn]

Does this 'threaded stud rod' stuff need to be anything specalist, or can I use m8 steel rod from my hardware store?

[Onoff]

10 minutes ago, zoothorn said:

Does this 'threaded stud rod' stuff need to be anything specalist, or can I use m8 steel rod from my hardware store?

 

If it's not stainless it'll rust.

 

M8 stud 10mm masonry bit

 

M10 stud 12mm masonry bit

 

Stop whinging.

[Declan52]

You can use the same threaded bar to attach the beams to your posts. A nail/ screw just to hold it all in place then drill straight through beam and post and put your washers and nuts on and tighten it up. 

Don't skimp on the fixings that you use for the base. It's the only thing keeping your shed attached to the ground. Threaded bar and resin will be the easiest method for you. Just do as @Onoff stated above. Have all the holes drilled and all the threaded bar cut to size with the tops taped up  and the holes cleaned out then it's only a 60 sec job each base. Squirt the resin, drop, the rod in, twist it and leave it plumb then move onto the next hole. When you have done each base clean the excess and base is finished. Then repeat and repeat until all are done. 

[zoothorn]

4 minutes ago, Onoff said:

 

 

 

Stop whinging.

 ? ok I'll try but I'm stressed.

 

Look just going back to these thunderbolts- only a £few extra on the shoe brackets after all, so cheaper to go with these in fact.

 

Is the idea with these to -not- use resin as well? & how do I do these flange-head hex heads up? (do they need a specialist tool attatchment thing?)

 

 

[Onoff]

 

You drill a hole and screw in the Thunderbolt with no resin required.

 

or

 

You drill a hole, clean it, pump in resin and push in a stud

 

In both cases a spanner should do, to wind the Thunderbolt in or do thd nuts up on the stud. Aratchet with socket better.

 

[Onoff]

I YouTube'd "resin anchors":

 

 

 

Think I said fill 50% earlier and this vid says 70%. Tbh I tend to overfill anyway. They wait until it's set to chip off the excess I wipe with a bit of card as the stud goes in. All much of a muchness.

Edited September 17, 2019 by Onoff

[Onoff]

And this is pretty much a Thunderbolt:

 

 

[zoothorn]

@Onoff thanks for those. I have done some YT clips but didn't see these. Found one place for st steel rods, but its the gubbins stuff that worries me/ hardening in the tube (I couldn't figure out your post before re. this).. its expensive so if I mess up I'm stuffed. I also don't much like angle grinding metal let alone hack sawing up a m10 rod.

 

How much stronger/ better is the steel rod method + resin than these thunderbolts? if I can drive th'bolts in (still not sure if they need a special socket attatchment to do up, or a std socket attatchment) I think its the preferable method.

[zoothorn]

Ok stop the website everyone pay attention- Im going with 10mm bar & gubbins & nuts. I'll have to get more manly & tackle the angle grinder.

 

How long each bar section into concrete?

[Onoff]

9 minutes ago, zoothorn said:

Ok stop the website everyone pay attention- Im going with 10mm bar & gubbins & nuts. I'll have to get more manly & tackle the angle grinder.

 

How long each bar section into concrete?

 

HANG ON!

 

Until you get the Taurus shoe you don't know the hole size for sure i.e whether it will take an M10 fixing stud!

 

You might have to stick with an M8 resin stud.

 

Depending on which resin you get e.g Rawlplug, Fischer, DeWalt, No Nonsense etc then hole depth might vary a bit. For example:

 

[zoothorn]

Ah bugger. Ok understood.. but couldn't I use my brass stepped hole enlarger bit if I find the hole a tad small?

 

I'll be getting the shoes thurs, & then was gonna get the stud & nuts, & drill bit from town to suit anyway.. so cheers for the info/ useful for my Depth. I'm going with fisher gubbins/ screwfix if they have it. A spanner will have to do to.

[zoothorn]

@Onoff sorry.. is there a difference between a m10 'fixing' stud, & a m8 'resin' stud/ apart from the size?

[zoothorn]

Hole dia is 8mm in the base. So I guess Im best sticking with this & not enlarging.

 

Cleaning out the hole.. does it need a special brush, or can I improvise with something.. or even blow the concrete out (goggles on etc)?

[Onoff]

Fischer resin is my goto stuff. Rawlplug resin second.

 

Resin stud/fixing stud = same thing. Stud/studding is just threaded bar, sometimes called "all thread", "threaded rod" etc. You can buy ready cut resin studs or 1m lengths and cut your own as aforementioned.

 

Push comes to shove you could open up the 8mm hole in the shoe with a normal, HSS drill bit from your drill set as long as they're half decent.

 

If using 8mm stud you will have to use the shoe as a guide for the 4 holes using an 8mm, masonry bit. once the holes are drilled you will need to open them up to 10mm diameter. So there'll be 1mm all around the 8mm stud for the resin to fill.

 

You may find you are off a bit and end up having to enlarge one or more holes in the shoe. If you do then paint the drilled metal with Screwfix 40801 (my goto is Toolstation 60070 but think you only have a Screwfix?)

 

Cleaning the hole is v.important. I always use a puffer. Some people use a hoover and/or compressor. The thing is a puffer is a two way action. it blasts air in and sucks it out agitating loose stuff in the walls of the drilled hole. A compressor can push debris into the walls of the hole where it won't come out but isn't in fact that well "bonded". So the resin goes onto a "loose" particle. Ditto a hoover. The tiny bottle brush thing followed by puffer system is best.

 

I have, once at home, cobbled together one of the resin gun nozzles on the end of the hoover hose to get in the hole and "suck" the debris, then switched the hose to the blow side of the vac, keep switching. Rough but I couldn't find the puffer at the time. 

 

 

[Onoff]

Did you buy a laser level?

 

Have you figured how high each plinth is relative to one another yet?

 

Could mean your front legs are different heights and your "50mm" packing at the rear corners varies one side to the other.

 

Are the rear two corners, the up slope ones, of the frame going to be affixed to the concrete plinth in any way? Don't think that's been discussed yet?

 

I presume you'll be making your basic base frame with the shoes on then marking through the holes in the shoes before drilling? Might need to move the frame to one side for access.

Edited September 18, 2019 by Onoff

[zoothorn]

On 18/09/2019 at 06:12, Onoff said:

Did you buy a laser level?

 

Have you figured how high each plinth is relative to one another yet?

 

Could mean your front legs are different heights and your "50mm" packing at the rear corners varies one side to the other.

 

Are the rear two corners, the up slope ones, of the frame going to be affixed to the concrete plinth in any way? Don't think that's been discussed yet?

 

I presume you'll be making your basic base frame with the shoes on then marking through the holes in the shoes before drilling? Might need to move the frame to one side for access.

 

Thanks for this & prior post- soaking up info. Got good weather so need to try get something done on the base today/ tmrw. Shoes here today. St Steel bar & fisher resin buying AM, & Irwin clamps (8mm bar/ nuts for shoes, 10mm etc for timber fixing). Use a sink plug cleaner for holes (similar brushy endy bit) & hoover. Ok I'm all set here.

 

But the basic timber design, & plan of attack I'm not sorted on yet. I 1st need to find something to lift the topside beams off the plinths (Only 1" or so.. I just can't have the whole thing any higher).. then attatch the beam > to the plinth. Like a square of plastic or something. Is the best/ only(?) idea for my plan of attack.. to make the frame, with shoes on, then plonk down onto plinths > mark holes?? not sure if I can manage weight alone if so.

 

And I've got figure out if my extra RH stream side walky cantilevered area is viable (a worthwhile addition surely ONLY IF I can make a separate/ afterbuilt/ additional/ later front deck area.. & the two could be linked to step from front deck >> onto side walky). Can anyone understand what I mean here? this is really holding me up as I've no idea if a separate/ afterbuild front deck area is even possible.
 

[zoothorn]

@Onoff I think I've got to scrap the side walky addition + making a later structure in front/ I just haven't a clue how to design the two to join.

 

Ok so instead: if I swizzle the 2x cantilevered beams FORWARD towards the house, to form the front deck area (so NOT protruding over twds the stream / cabin RH side, as was my orig idea).

 

So one loooong beam will be sat upon two high-slope plinths (no pillars). And the other loooong beam will be sat on two stream-side plinths with pillars. Is there any confusion to understand what I'm suggesting?