Local Development Planning

[drb5374]

Has anyone had their plots looked over by their LDP?

 

Out site is currently there and has been for nearly a year. Got some good initial views from them through the Council website, but I’ve been told it can take up to 4 years to get their full thought. 

 

Troubke is our site was/is on green belt and although it supposedly had a very small house on it a long time ago, we were always told by planning, it had to have an agricultural or horticultural business on the site if a house was to be built. Now that the LDP and government is pushing for new homes to be built, it was worth a shot at getting more than 1 house to be built on our site and leave the idea of a business behind. 

 

Just keen to move on on and start looking into plans, services, removal/moving of water pipes, etc. The site is NOT straightforward at all, so any help and speed on decisions is welcomed. 

Edited February 11, 2018 by drb5374

[ProDave]

Have you actually tried a planning application?

 

Our site was perhaps a but similar in that it was a vacant empty plot just overgrown with scrub.  It sat between 2 existing houses.

 

A few years ago when the council were updating their local plan, the then owner tried to get is zoned for housing development and failed. (There is already a piece of land at the top of our road with a now derelict wooden former restaurant that is zoned for housing on the local plan)

 

But in spite of our plot failing to get zoned for housing at the last local plan update, it did get planning. Our local plan has a presumption against "new housing in the hinterland" unless it meets one of 3 conditions. One of those is an infill plot between houses in an established development, so ours passed that and got planning, even though it had no designation on the local plan.

[Jeremy Harris]

I was peripherally involved in creating the Neighbourhood Plan for the village where our old house is, and this included identifying sites that could be developed to meet local housing needs, and all of these sites were outside the development boundary.  The Neighbourhood Plan was written by the village, with everyone having a chance to contribute, both by questionnaire and by meetings in the village hall, and was then agreed by the local authority and became an intrinsic part of the local development plan.  As such it pretty much guarantees that new proposals for development of the identified sites would not face the usual problem of having to argue the specific point as to why development should take place outside the defined development boundary.  The odd thing was that the Neighbourhood Plan has a fair bit of clout when it comes to planning, but doesn't actually change the existing development boundary line, it just gives a reason to develop outside it in certain areas.

[drb5374]

Thanks guys. 

 

We previously had planning permission for a roundhouse and 2 nursery greenhouses, but steel became very expensive at the time and the planning lapsed...probably for the best to be honest. 

 

I’ve attached what the LDP said about the site. Quite positive. 

[ProDave]

Given that positive statement, I would proceed with a planning application.

[Jeremy Harris]

Just now, ProDave said:

Given that positive statement, I would proceed with a planning application.

 

Me too.  That's as clear an indication as I've seen that they would like to see this brownfield site put to some useful purpose.

[drb5374]

So you wouldn’t wait to hear what else the LDP have to say? Couldn’t there be more to come from them?

[Jeremy Harris]

I'd just get an application in, using the info you have now, and deal with anything else that comes in as the planning process proceeds.

[drb5374]

Ok, thank you very much. 

 

Is outline planning the best way forward, especially if 3 buildings is what we are considering?

 

Sorry if that’s a daft question. I’ve been trying to figure out why bother with outline planning, when it can take so long for an outcome that gives no real guarantee. 

[ProDave]

Be careful if going for outline planning (actually called Planning In Principle in Scotland). If you don't provide many details, you may find unwanted conditions attached.  e.g when I did my PIP application, I didn't give much details about the house and as a result it came back with a condition that the roof must be done in natural slate. I later managed to get chat changed to a particular concrete tile that has a bit of a slate like finish.  If I had specified all the finishes I might have avoided that.

 

The advantage of PIP is it is usually much quicker  and you don't need lots of expensive detailed drawings. it is the normal route if someone is planning to get permission then sell the plot. In my case it was to establish the principle of building a house on the plot before I bought it.

[Ferdinand]

You need to consider what your position would be were your site to be excluded from the LDP. And it was then brought into force.

[drb5374]

Brilliant points made, thank you very much.  

 

Lots to consider...I’m sure there will be many more questions. ???

[Ferdinand]

This could be one for a Planning Consultant, one who has won previous similar local PPs.

 

And consider whether you will be willing to Appeal, and if so make sure the budget is there if yes ... for whichever type of appeal you would consider.

[drb5374]

Nice one. ??

 

Appealling a decision is an expensive route then?

[Ian]

1 minute ago, drb5374 said:

Appealling a decision is an expensive route then?

The appeal itself is free but getting ready for one costs if you’re using a consultant

[Ian]

@drb5374

I agree with @Ferdinand that employing a Planning Consultant would be a good idea.

Even though I’m an architect I employed one on my own build and we got the PP we were hoping for, even though we had to go to appeal. We definitely wouldn’t have got it without the consultant and he wasn’t expensive.

[Ferdinand]

1 hour ago, drb5374 said:

Nice one. ??

 

Appealling a decision is an expensive route then?

 

IT depends .

 

When we got PP for our family Land (inside the community boundary and enough for a small housing estate) which had been in the allocations for housing for about 5 years and was then excluded at the last point because of a cocked-up Sustainability Analysis by the Council, we judged it was either

 

1 Accept what is the likely decision which will leave it out Until the next Local Plan which would be 2028.

2 Apply for PP now before policy exists which is against getting PP because it would be zoned Open Space not Housing. IMplemented Council policy has significant weight in the planning process.

 

We budgeted for an Appeal from day one, and our stake money in the game of Planning Poker was a legacy which we could continue to live quite comfortably without if we lost it in the Planning game. We would have had a field costing perhaps £500 a year to maintain if we lost.

 

Cannot remember whether the appellant gets to choose the forum. There is no Council Fee but our Planning Consultant gave us 3 estimates for his and other costs. As ours was a larger project we hired a very experienced Planning Consultant who regularly appeared at Public Enquiries and Higher Courts etc, and had won a couple of controversial Local appeals with our Council.

 

Your costs may be entirely different, but you need a consultant who can win on the benefits of your development outbalancing the reasons for not doing it, which are stringent in the green belt in England at least. IT would help you to find out if is really in Green Belt or not. There are 3 fora:

 

1 - Written Representations. A couple of thousand for his time. SOme people do this one themselves.

2 - A Hearing. Informal with the Inspector and the applicant, Council and reps in the room. Up to a few thousand.

3 - A local Public Enquiry. Potentially requiring a barrister for a number of days. UP to £25k to be safe.

 

We won on Appeal with written representations. The Council Case was weak.

 

In the end the Council Local Plan was rejected as inadequate and they were told to start again.

 

Ferdinand

 

Edited February 11, 2018 by Ferdinand

[Ferdinand]

I would also add take a hard headed look at the strength of your family and relationship, and make sure you are all committed and have discussed potential costs and consequences of them saying no. And that you have read our blogs about the time and stress involved.

 

This process ... especially if you lose say 10k or 20k without return in Planning Costs ... can stress or sometimes wreck relationships.

Edited February 11, 2018 by Ferdinand

[drb5374]

LoL sounds all about right....considered leaving the Mrs already and we haven't done anything yet!

 

Thanks very much all. Lots to think about!