Background

 

Back in 1991 when we moved in the utility room, kitchen and conservatory had hard vinyl tiles on the floors - they were stuck down with some bitumen type adhesive - took me a good week to get them all up (they chipped and cracked and only came up in little bits) and then getting what was left of the floor involved some fairly aggressive solvents.

 

Mrs Alien wanted ceramic tiles for all of them (so I bought enough grey square ceramic floor tiles to do all of them) so after making good the floor I over boarded with 3.5 mm ply nailed to the chipboard and then tile adhesive and tiles. My reason for the over-boarding was if she ever wanted to change the tiles I could lift both tile and ply up in sections and not have to scrape/chip/grind tile adhesive off the chipboard.

 

Now my one big error was not doing wall to wall tiling in both rooms - I did in the conservatory but I did that one first (Hindsight is wonderful) and I only did the floor area in the kitchen up to the kick board and the same in the utility. The downside is it creates a weir if you have any water leaks under the cupboards and you don't notice the leak until it's been happening for a while. (water softener I'm looking at you now)

 

So right now I'm embarking on re-doing the utility (kitchen is next as I'm transferring some of the wall and floor units to the utility before the new kitchen arrives in Nov/Dec) it's a 2m x 2m room that is now empty and I'm replacing most of the floor because it wasn't great last time I tiled it (think floor areas under units that looked like dried out wheatabix) 

 

I spent Saturday lifting the tiles and over-boarding - once I'd got a start point a decent pry bar, claw hammer and bolster meant it lifted fairly easily in small sections. I could then take outside and with tile face down fold the ply to break it on the grout lines and I ended up with a half full wheelie bin 

 

So the current plan is new chipboard floor - 3.5mm ply over-boarding (stapled) and then wall to wall tiled and grouted before units are moved in.

 

Am I missing an alternative method - neither kitchen or Utility are a wet room but both have wet services!!

 

 

 

 

Tiling on a chipboard floor i think needs more then that 3.5mm for over boarding, closely to 10mm screwed every 150 I think is best practise.

 

Most modern homes with tiles installed, it's not long before you spot the cracks along the joint lines where they haven't removed the flex in the subfloor.

1 minute ago, Andeh said:

Tiling on a chipboard floor i think needs more then that 3.5mm for over boarding, closely to 10mm screwed every 150 I think is best practise.

 

Most modern homes with tiles installed, it's not long before you spot the cracks along the joint lines where they haven't removed the flex in the subfloor.

interesting point thanks for that - current tiles have been down since 1994 - never re-grouted in that time and none was missing till I started lifting sections - floor joists are less than 400 mm centres with 18mm T&G chipboard. I'm a bit hesitant to increase over-boarding thickness because it will create a step at the threshold between rooms and adjoining hallway

1 hour ago, marshian said:

Back in 1991 when we moved in the utility room, kitchen and conservatory had hard vinyl tiles on the floors

Consider a decoupling mat, even if to rule out. 

9 minutes ago, Gus Potter said:

Consider a decoupling mat, even if to rule out. 

What is that or should I google?

If you are putting a new floor deck down, would ply be a better option than chip?

24 minutes ago, crispy_wafer said:

If you are putting a new floor deck down, would ply be a better option than chip?

 

Possibly - not sure on what advantage that would give me?

I took the advice of big Nicky and put 6mm ply over the chipboard, notched PVA comb and then an unholy amount of screws.

 

 

5 minutes ago, Super_Paulie said:

I took the advice of big Nicky and put 6mm ply over the chipboard, notched PVA comb and then an unholy amount of screws.

 

 

 

I'm not counting the screws............................... (It's a lot!!!)

9 hours ago, marshian said:

 

I'm not counting the screws............................... (It's a lot!!!)

about 300 i think. My back didnt thank me put it that way.

Edited Tuesday at 08:245 days by Super_Paulie

I would consider using 22mm Egger Protect boards, glued and screwed.  They are much more resilient and a bit stiffer.  You could also use a decoupling mat under the tiles but it will add a few mm to the build-up and a bit to the cost.  Flexible adhesive in any case.

in my landing and bathroom ive 22mm P5 glued and screwed and then 6mm ply glued and screwed. Makes the suspended floor feel like solid concrete. 

Well Floor replaced and over boarded with 3.6mm ply as planned - nice and flat and very very solid.

 

now ready for tiles unless I need to coat the ply with something to stop it stealing the water out of the adhesive too quickly?

 

 

4 hours ago, marshian said:

Well Floor replaced and over boarded with 3.6mm ply as planned - nice and flat and very very solid.

 

now ready for tiles unless I need to coat the ply with something to stop it stealing the water out of the adhesive too quickly?

 

 

 

SBR Bond before you tile, will give much better adhesion as well as water proofing

I used UltraTile Pro Primer. It looks and smells exactly like SBR and out of the 5L I used barely a mouthful... Would just use SBR if I could go back.

11 hours ago, MikeGrahamT21 said:

 

SBR Bond before you tile, will give much better adhesion as well as water proofing

Do you dilute it or apply neat?

9 hours ago, Super_Paulie said:

I used UltraTile Pro Primer. It looks and smells exactly like SBR and out of the 5L I used barely a mouthful... Would just use SBR if I could go back.

Thanks

18 minutes ago, marshian said:

Do you dilute it or apply neat?

I used it neat, creates a nice ‘rubbery’ surface

Floor now ready for SBR Bond

So did you simply staple that down with no glue? Id be worried about movement with expansion or vibration from the washing machine. Saying that if it held firm since the early 90s then it sounds like it's solid enough. Enjoy your Sunday fella, your back will be broken be 5pm.

12 hours ago, Super_Paulie said:

I used barely a mouthful...

What an interesting way of measuring you have! What's it taste like? ;)

Edited 4 hours ago4 hr by -rick-

1 hour ago, Super_Paulie said:

So did you simply staple that down with no glue? Id be worried about movement with expansion or vibration from the washing machine. Saying that if it held firm since the early 90s then it sounds like it's solid enough. Enjoy your Sunday fella, your back will be broken be 5pm.

yep - 18mm chipboard floor screwed down to joists - 400 centres (was previously nailed) then 3.6mm ply stapled with 22mm staples - no glue. (Previously it was nailed to the chipboard) Never had an issue with any grout cracking or popping out in 20 plus years so same again seems logical.

Only difference is this time I'm tiling wall to wall instead of to the plinth of the floor unit