Water softener

[AdamD]

We live in a hard water area and have recently got a new en suite which we’re going put in Matte black shower, taps etc and have been advised a water softener is a good idea due to the levels of limescale. Makes sense really as we get an awful lot on our chrome shower.

 

any thoughts and suggestions as to which to get, for a family of 4, 4 bed semi detached average sized house.

[Marvin]

We have used Kinetico and use a Monarch. Many other brands available.

 

Things we considered were:

If the regeneration is governed by time, or use of water.

The type of salt used v cost: blocks or tablets or grains.

If the machine requires electricity or not.

Different capacity machines for different amounts of occupants.

 

You may wish to consider how you will obtain non-softened water for the garden for example or filling some heating systems.

The system will need to flush waste water and will require an overflow pipe in case of failure. 

[marshian]

4 Bed - 2 occupants but we sized the unit for full occupancy (ie family of 4)

 

We have very hard water. (from memory the test result was 400 but it might have been 600)

 

BWT metered water softener - so regens by volume thro it rather than a fixed time interval

 

It is powered 24/7

 

We use roughly 100 - 125 kgs of salt per year (tablets rather than blocks)  so max £100 per year

 

Before installation

 

1. A washing machine was doing well if it lasted 5 years

 

2. Shower screens, sinks, toilets and taps would need regular applications of limescale remover

 

3. When you washed your hair it felt like straw (According to Mrs Alien)

 

4. For clothes to smell of washing powder (apparently this is a good thing) it would take the max dose recommended

 

After installation

 

1. Current WMC is now 10 years old (replaced just after fitting Water Softener)

 

2. Can't remember the last time we used viakal anywhere (If I could stop Mrs Alien using bleach (wrecking chrome and rubber seals) I would have a perfect life

 

3. Hair apparently in no longer like straw (According to Mrs Alien)

 

4. We have a line on the washing powder cup and it's sod all but the clothes still smell of washing powder (apparently a good thing)

[AdamD]

Thanks both, really useful.

 

the bwt one I was looking at, screwfix right? Is it mains powered or does it not need electrical input? 
 

is the installation particularly difficult?

 

any concerns such as the attached I’ve read online? 

[marshian]

1 hour ago, AdamD said:

Thanks both, really useful.

 

the bwt one I was looking at, screwfix right? Is it mains powered or does it not need electrical input? 
 

is the installation particularly difficult?

 

any concerns such as the attached I’ve read online? 

 

We have an un-softened water tap in the kitchen for cooking and drinking (yes this means that a year is good going for a kettle)

 

We don't drink the water from any other tap as all the other cold and hot taps have always been fed from a gravity supplied CW tank in the loft 

[marshian]

1 hour ago, AdamD said:

the bwt one I was looking at, screwfix right? Is it mains powered or does it not need electrical input? 
 

is the installation particularly difficult?

 

Took about 60 mins to install with the mains isolator shut - hardest bit was drilling through the wall to put the overflow pipe outside and getting an airlock out of the cold feed to the loft tank

 

It's powered by a small transformer like a house phone charger - I assume it doesn't need a lot of power to run a control panel and work a rotary valve or two in the regen process

 

Iooking back at my water usage it's probably accounted for a 8-10L per day uptick in usage - pretty sure that will be driven by the re-gen process waste

[AdamD]

7 hours ago, marshian said:

4 Bed - 2 occupants but we sized the unit for full occupancy (ie family of 4)

 

We have very hard water. (from memory the test result was 400 but it might have been 600)

 

BWT metered water softener - so regens by volume thro it rather than a fixed time interval

 

It is powered 24/7

 

We use roughly 100 - 125 kgs of salt per year (tablets rather than blocks)  so max £100 per year

 

Before installation

 

1. A washing machine was doing well if it lasted 5 years

 

2. Shower screens, sinks, toilets and taps would need regular applications of limescale remover

 

3. When you washed your hair it felt like straw (According to Mrs Alien)

 

4. For clothes to smell of washing powder (apparently this is a good thing) it would take the max dose recommended

 

After installation

 

1. Current WMC is now 10 years old (replaced just after fitting Water Softener)

 

2. Can't remember the last time we used viakal anywhere (If I could stop Mrs Alien using bleach (wrecking chrome and rubber seals) I would have a perfect life

 

3. Hair apparently in no longer like straw (According to Mrs Alien)

 

4. We have a line on the washing powder cup and it's sod all but the clothes still smell of washing powder (apparently a good thing)

Is this something like what you’ve got?

https://www.screwfix.com/p/bwt-water-softener-14ltr/62242

[marshian]

2 hours ago, AdamD said:

Is this something like what you’ve got?

https://www.screwfix.com/p/bwt-water-softener-14ltr/62242

Yep but older model it’s been in about 10 years

[MikeSharp01]

Is the BTW unit a twin tank or does it do its cleaning in the middle of the night and is this not wasteful?

 

[AdamD]

8 hours ago, marshian said:

Yep but older model it’s been in about 10 years

Does it impact the water pressure? I see they have a high flow one, does that mean better pressure within the house? Appreciate that may be a stupid question and not remotely linked!!

[Marvin]

5 minutes ago, AdamD said:

Does it impact the water pressure? I see they have a high flow one, does that mean better pressure within the house? Appreciate that may be a stupid question and not remotely linked!!

Not a stupid question.

They can effect Flow rate and we use high flow pipes.

[Marvin]

Hi @AdamD

 

Forgot to add:

 

8 minutes ago, AdamD said:

Appreciate that may be a stupid question and not remotely linked!!

Definitely linked, especially if you are running lots of high flow items like showers at the same time.

[marshian]

15 minutes ago, AdamD said:

Does it impact the water pressure? I see they have a high flow one, does that mean better pressure within the house? Appreciate that may be a stupid question and not remotely linked!!

if it does I can’t tell because the whole house bar one tap is fed from a tank in the loft - when a bath has been drawn it doesn’t seem like a long time for the CWT to catch up

[marshian]

1 hour ago, MikeSharp01 said:

Is the BTW unit a twin tank or does it do its cleaning in the middle of the night and is this not wasteful?

 

Mine is a single tank BWT 

 

Yes it regens at 2am in the morning but not every night 

 

it has some sort of monitoring system so it only regens if the water usage reaches a point where it would have to force a regen in the next day so it does it the night before 

 

well that’s how it appears to work I stopped monitoring it a long time ago

[Dreadnaught]

I have a refurbished "Atlantis AT350" softener and paid £275 inc. VAT for it, collected from their warehouse in Cambridgeshire.

 

It's very economic with water, uses a tried-and-tested valve, and has a single tank.

 

Very nice people to deal with and very knowledgable as they manufacturer them.

 

 

 

 

[Nickfromwales]

1 minute ago, Dreadnaught said:

I have a refurbished "Atlantis AT350" softener and paid £275 inc. VAT for it, collected from their warehouse in Cambridgeshire.

 

It's very economic with water, uses a tried-and-tested valve, and has a single tank.

 

Very nice people to deal with and very knowledgable as they manufacturer them.

That’s a very good price!

[marshian]

1 hour ago, Nickfromwales said:

That’s a very good price!

I agree and a 10 year warranty!!!

[AdamD]

All good, got the bwt one and installed in a few hours the other day. Can tell the difference in the water softness! Fingers crossed it saves out matte black bathroom bits and helps the appliances!

[marshian]

4 hours ago, AdamD said:

All good, got the bwt one and installed in a few hours the other day. Can tell the difference in the water softness! Fingers crossed it saves out matte black bathroom bits and helps the appliances!

 

Good to hear that you can already tell the difference - with a CWT in the loft it took a little longer to notice the change

 

Now one piece of advice @AdamD if the house has been running with hard water for a long time keep an eye out for leaks for the next few months - usual places toilet cisterns underneath taps under sinks all those sort of areas - if everywhere is mains pressure it will probably be fine but it's worth keeping an eye out.

 

The reason is simple "Softened" water will take back into solution any limescale deposits that have built up over the years - I found two places where this resulted in a leak - one was the outlet on my CWT in the loft - the other a gravity fed toilet cistern where the flexi union started leaking.