Insulating 16mm Pex-Al-Pex pipes

[RichJ]

Hi

 

Does anyone know if you can get pipe lagging (Climaflex etc) for insulating 16mm Pex-Al-Pex pipes? I'm thinking of running Pex-Al-Pex between manifolds and radiators in my new central heating setup.

 

I've found PSW Trade suppliers have a pre-insulated pipe (https://pswtradesuppliers.co.uk/ufh-pipes/771-1182-multilayer-composite-pre-insulated-pex-al-pex-pipe-16-32mm-for-water-system.html#/14-color-blue/87-size-16mm_x_100m_coil) but the insulation on it is only 7mm whereas I'd prefer something closer to 20mm.

 

Any ideas?

Edited December 9, 2023 by RichJ

[MikeGrahamT21]

Just use the stuff for 15mm, it’s just a tighter fit, that’s all I used, thick walled 15mm ID climaflex 👍🏻

[RichJ]

Wow. Shouldn't I be paying you for responding in seconds??

 

So obvious. I owe you one.

[crispy_wafer]

@RichJ  Hi, would you mind posting what bits you'd be using please?  I'm going to run piping in for rads upstairs (just in case!) and whilst I got access to the voids, and leave tails where they can be got at.  But am going round in circles deciding what products to use...  Manifold, eurocones and left over UFH pipe...  Or just make up a copper manifold and balance at the rads.  Have you sussed out the transition from 16mm - 15mm.

 

Marek

[MikeGrahamT21]

  On 09/12/2023 at 18:49, RichJ said:

Wow. Shouldn't I be paying you for responding in seconds??

 

So obvious. I owe you one.

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you posted just at the right time! 😂 

[MikeGrahamT21]

  On 09/12/2023 at 20:23, crispy_wafer said:

@RichJ  Hi, would you mind posting what bits you'd be using please?  I'm going to run piping in for rads upstairs (just in case!) and whilst I got access to the voids, and leave tails where they can be got at.  But am going round in circles deciding what products to use...  Manifold, eurocones and left over UFH pipe...  Or just make up a copper manifold and balance at the rads.  Have you sussed out the transition from 16mm - 15mm.

 

Marek

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If you get the right eurocones as I did after a few trial purchases, they fit directly in a normal TRV and lockshield, so no messy conversions

[RichJ]

  On 09/12/2023 at 20:23, crispy_wafer said:

@RichJ  Hi, would you mind posting what bits you'd be using please?  I'm going to run piping in for rads upstairs (just in case!) and whilst I got access to the voids, and leave tails where they can be got at.  But am going round in circles deciding what products to use...  Manifold, eurocones and left over UFH pipe...  Or just make up a copper manifold and balance at the rads.  Have you sussed out the transition from 16mm - 15mm.

 

Marek

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I've gone with a 6 port manifold from Wunda with their eurocones for 16mm Pex-Al-Pex/Pert-Al-Pert for about £160. Not cheap but it's apparently good kit. I need to source some ball valves for the inlets from somewhere yet.

 

https://www.wundatrade.co.uk/shop/home/quick-shop/wundatherm-quick-shop/manifolds-quickshop/6-port-premium-manifold-2/

 

For some reason a lot of online sellers now seem to prefer Pert-Al-Pert over Pex-Al-Pex, but am probably going with the Pex-Al-Pex from these guys 

 

https://www.thefloorheatingwarehouse.co.uk/

 

I suspect the missus won't appreciate feeding plastic pipe directly into the rads (visually). I might try it out as a test - running the pipe up through the floor at the centre point of the radiator and looping it round behind the radiator. Alternatively I'll go with something like this under the floor https://www.elementshop.co.uk/16mm-x-15mm-coupling.

 

As you can probably tell, I've not nailed down much yet. But I've decided where the manifolds can be located that will work well.

[RichJ]

Might go with these for converting to copper... https://www.thefloorheatingwarehouse.co.uk/product/compression-fit-to-copper-adaptors/

[HughF]

Do you have a press gun with U jaws? Often job lots of transitions available on ebay for cheap, I’ve got a bucket full…

 

Natural Green Heat do a nice series of push-fit 16mm stuff, fully demountable, fyi…

Edited December 10, 2023 by HughF

[Andehh]

Would recommend wrapping it in duct tape at regular intervals if a tight fit!

[crispy_wafer]

  On 10/12/2023 at 06:33, HughF said:

Do you have a press gun with U jaws? Often job lots of transitions available on ebay for cheap, I’ve got a bucket full…

 

Natural Green Heat do a nice series of push-fit 16mm stuff, fully demountable, fyi…

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I was going to press, one way or the other.  I could obtain some 16mm U jaws if it came to using the pert.  Does the pipe need to be a certain type for pressing.  Or would a load of Wunda pert al pert be suitable, I've got a handful of 15-30m offcuts left over from the UFH install.

 

It was the transition from 16mm to 15mm that was causing me a bit of worry.  I think I've seen eurocone adapters mentioned perviously on this forum, then there are the long press tails too.  When there are many ways to attack a job I get confused in choosing the most appropriate/professional way.  

 

  On 09/12/2023 at 21:27, MikeGrahamT21 said:

If you get the right eurocones as I did after a few trial purchases, they fit directly in a normal TRV and lockshield, so no messy conversions

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Please would you mind sharing?

 

  On 09/12/2023 at 22:06, RichJ said:

I suspect the missus won't appreciate feeding plastic pipe directly into the rads (visually). I might try it out as a test - running the pipe up through the floor at the centre point of the radiator and looping it round behind the radiator.

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As long as the pipe is straight, the a bit of foil tape wrapped round the pipe to make it look like chrome, or there are those pipe covers...  Bringing the pipe up behind has a few benefits, in that if you need to trim a bit of pipe for whatever reason, then you can do so quite safely without it eventually disappearing into the floor (Thinking of maintenance in future years) 

 

 

[HughF]

I’ve used twetop brand and geberit, both on 16x2 pex/pert-al and regular continal pex (no al)…

 

No leaks on any of it. I figured if the o-rings seal on the inside and the stuff squashes down, you’re good to go.

 

I generally use WRAS approved UFH pipe for everything… I usually buy end-of-rolls off Facebook 🤣

 

 

 

 

[HughF]

Personally I’d use chrome press tails with the joint below the floor .

[MikeGrahamT21]

I used cable ties at regular intervals to keep it a tight fit all along.

 

all my stuff came from psw trade suppliers, the eurocones (brass coloured) have just one external sealing ring, making it a perfect fit for a TRV - https://pswtradesuppliers.co.uk/brass-compression-fittings/92-117-16mmx34-eurocone-adapter.html#/39-pack_of-1

 

another bonus is no press fit, it’s all compression but works an absolute dream.

 

 

 

[RichJ]

  On 10/12/2023 at 13:46, MikeGrahamT21 said:

I used cable ties at regular intervals to keep it a tight fit all along.

 

all my stuff came from psw trade suppliers, the eurocones (brass coloured) have just one external sealing ring, making it a perfect fit for a TRV - https://pswtradesuppliers.co.uk/brass-compression-fittings/92-117-16mmx34-eurocone-adapter.html#/39-pack_of-1

 

another bonus is no press fit, it’s all compression but works an absolute dream.

 

 

 

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Did you get your manifolds from PSW? Are you happy with them?

 

Did you go for the brass ones or stainless? 

[MikeGrahamT21]

  On 10/12/2023 at 16:12, RichJ said:

 

Did you get your manifolds from PSW? Are you happy with them?

 

Did you go for the brass ones or stainless? 

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yeah, stainless steel, not had any issues, was easy enough to install even in the tight space I had for use (under the floor in a small hallway).

 

Found this from an old PM: 

I found from the kit I used there were 2 types of cone, one which has a double seal on the opposite end to the 16mm connection and one which has a single seal, the single seal ones fit perfectly in a 15mm TRV thus converting it to 16mm without any hassle.

 

some very old photos too before I finished the floor

 

Edited December 10, 2023 by MikeGrahamT21