Costs to install 8.5kw Mitsubishi R32 ASHP

[Meabh]

Our ICF build on the coast east of Edinburgh is well underway. We put a pre-insulated Flow/Return pipe under the slab from the ASHP location to the plant room. We will be applying for the Home Energy Scotland grant of £7,500 towards the heatpump (and £2,500 towards battery & PV). 

 

I'm looking for a sense check on my quote for the ASHP (my comparable quotes all quoted much bigger heat pumps - too big).

 

Are the below numbers the sort of amounts people are paying?

Many thanks

 

Total supply & install £14,638

Less grant of £7,500 = £7,138

 

Supply £7,488

 - Mitsubishi R32 8.5kw Coastal heatpump

- Mitsubishi 250 l unvented hot water tank

 - Mitsubishs controls, anti vibration feet, flexi pipes, drain kit, Glycol/Antifreeze

 - Preinsulated flow/return pipe for under slab £666

 

Supply £2,200

 - Plumbing kit (pipes, fittings, insulation)

 

 - Install, test & commission £3k

 - Electrician to connect up heating system & controls £850

(wants to use his own electrician rather than mine)

 - MCS prep of design/size/paperwork so we can apply for grant £1.1k

Total Labour £4,950

 

[JohnMo]

How big is your new build ICF house to require an 8.5kW heat pump?

 

Let's is know U values, size, single storey etc, airtightness and UFH or rads?

 

I'm at around best part of 225m2 (including plant room) and have just installed a 6kW and could have got away with 4kW.

 

Assume the quote doesn't include the heating system as nothing is mentioned?

 

To me the price looks like a total rip off!

[MR10]

2 hours ago, Meabh said:

Are the below numbers the sort of amounts people are paying?

 

No, those figures are a bit steep, get another quote.

[Meabh]

1 hour ago, JohnMo said:

How big is your new build ICF house to require an 8.5kW heat pump?

 

Let's is know U values, size, single storey etc, airtightness and UFH or rads?

 

I'm at around best part of 225m2 (including plant room) and have just installed a 6kW and could have got away with 4kW.

 

Assume the quote doesn't include the heating system as nothing is mentioned?

 

To me the price looks like a total rip off!

 - House is 226sqm ground floor and 100sqm first floor (it's like a bungalow with a bit on top so that ups the heat loss).

- UFH on GF only (no heating on first floor) by someone else

 - U values all low - floor 0.11, walls 0.14, roofs 0.14/0.16, triple glazed, MVHR, airtight target 2 (but should be lower)

 

It's cheaper than some of my other quotes - but they were going for 13-16kw ASHP's.

[Seren161]

We had nearly 14k ( 8 after the Govt grant) for a 12kW Arotherm plus.. Similar to your quote but electrics by our electrician and base built by our builder .. that was a year ago..  Difficult to know if it was overpriced..We were happy with the quality of installation etc etc 

[sharpener]

Maybe a bit on the high side. I have been quoted £12k8 and £13k7 all in for Stiebel-Eltron ACS 25 or Vaillant 12k, which are substantially more powerful. Both after deducting £5k BUS grant and including 7 and 10 new rads respectively.

[Kelvin]

I assume it doesn’t include the UFH? If it’s just the ASHP and HWC then it’s dear but comparable to nearly every quote I got. 

[Dave Jones]

your being ripped off my 10k due to the MCS scheme, they are charging £5k more knowing you will not be paying it.

 

Real cost for a heat pump and tank is £3k ish and 2-3 days labour to fit it.

 

We in same boat and no way im paying a plumber £3k a day labour just because he has a gov approved piece of paper.

[JamesPa]

The price is pretty typical of most of the quotes I have received and less than some.  @Dave Jones is spot on.  The industry, it appears, is currently dominated by grant harvesters.  There are of course gooduns out there but they appear to be in the minority.

[DougMLancs]

Have you tried Renewableheat.com? They’re based in Falkirk but might cover you? Barry Sharp did a great podcast on heat pumps in Scotland with Nathan Gambling. 

I’m not surprised that they want to use their own sparky who’s used to wiring heat pumps. Some are straightforward and intuitive but some like Grant can take a day to wire in!

 

How has the UFH been spec’d? 100mm centres and minimal zoning (ideally open loop) will work best for maximum efficiency.

[JohnMo]

16 minutes ago, DougMLancs said:

100mm centres

Why are people obsessed with 100mm centres in a low energy houses?

 

They are just not required to be that close for heating or cooling. Even at 20W/m2 there is only a 3 degree difference in mean flow temp, when comparing 300 to 100mm centres. A low energy low would be in the 15W/m2 or lower, the original poster would be in this range looking at the U values.

 

Once to get close 10W/m2 there is little difference. So much so that both have to run the heat pump at min flow temp for a heat pump anyway for both 100mm and 300mm centres. Which in its self can be problematic with a high mass UFH system as return temperature doesn't drop quickly enough.

[eniacs]

Meabh, 

 

I am presently installing that very heatpump at my own house DIY. Whilst i agree with what others have said to an extent, i think the quote you have had is not that far from reality.

 

The present purchase cost of the heat pumps and cylinder is pretty high in general, the heat pump and cylinder would be around 6k delivered. (This will be VAT free for the plumber, but any decent plumber will add 10-15% markup thus removing this benefit anyway.) Add onto that the cost of the underslab pipe and its not far from quoted.

 

On my install i have bought pump/filter/freeze valves/flexi connections/mounting feet etc from ebay at half normal cost. Plumbing fittings and pipe has cost me 2k at least. If i was buying new, this lot likely would have cost me 3k at least.

 

I dont know the entirety of your install, a lot of trades put a faff figure on if the project is far away from their house, going to need multiple visits etc as the build progresses?

 

Whilst I agree the MCS is a worthless government bit of paper, as a trade I too would add a figure onto the project to recoup the cost and effort of me obtaining it.

 

 

Your plumber is probably budgeting 2 people for 5 days and hoping it will take only 3 days. That's 400/day so about right for a good plumber for where I am. Not sure on pricing where you are.

[Post and beam]

1 hour ago, DougMLancs said:

How has the UFH been spec’d? 100mm centres and minimal zoning (ideally open loop) will work best for maximum efficiency.

 and this reply....

1 hour ago, JohnMo said:

Once to get close 10W/m2 there is little difference. So much so that both have to run the heat pump at min flow temp for a heat pump anyway for both 100mm and 300mm centres. Which in its self can be problematic with a high mass UFH system as return temperature doesn't drop quickly enough.

 And start a new thread to ask questions as i dont want to hijack this one.

[JohnMo]

So just out curiosity had a look about for pricing. Quite a few members have and speak highly of Cool Energy ASHP.

 

So on eBay I spotted this package - this will be a vat included price, so you should be able to claim any Vat back as you are doing a new build. Everything you need except the piping and a 3 way valve. Run the whole ground floor as a single zone no buffer, minimal electrics if UFH and cylinder are close proximity to the pipes you pre installed not much plumbing either. You shouldn't even need a mixer and pump on the UFH manifold, just run on weather compensation for heat pump circulation pump.

 

Put an electric towel radiator in you ensuite, with a timer thermostat, that is your second zone for building control.