Hello - Caravan Act compliant buildings

[Pinzameld]

Hello

 

i am joining after two years of dealing with utter intransigence and delays from my local authority (SE based) and the Inspectorate, who have, after almost a year of doing nothing, decided to turn down both our appeals for an extension, whilst telling us it looks great and would be fantastic, but computer says no.  So go away. PD doesn’t work either and green belt/AONB.  Judicial review won’t get us anywhere either. 

 

Catharsis over. 
 

What we now have to do is be creative (which costs more naturally).

 

So we are now at Caravan Act compliant structures - definitely not buildings.  Two to start with - one 7.5 x 3.9m and one roughly 5 x 3.6m

 

- And are trying to find someone who can a) design and provide to a standard a timber frame or SIPS manufacturer is happy to cut from 

 

but most importantly to design a suitable chassis (probably chunky timber or steel) so that we can demonstrate caravan act compliance to our already awkward council.  Which will include doing the structural calcs to demonstrate it won’t collapse like a soggy packet of cornflakes if it were, theoretically, to be lifted...
 

any pointers welcomed !!

 

(Then I have a bare shell refurb to deal with  ) 

 

thanks for reading.

[Temp]

Google can find mobile home or log cabin chassis for sale. They seem to range from £1500 to £5k. 

 

Think they will only carry weight of a timber frame structure.

[Nickfromwales]

@Pinzameld

 

Check out @Crofters blogs / posts. He’s done a demountable building under the same guidelines iirc. 

[Nickfromwales]

 

[ProDave]

Caravan act buildings usually just remove the need for building regs. You still need planning permission, unless it falls under a permitted development garden building.

[Pinzameld]

Thanks guys

 

on the Caravan Act and building point.  That’s (as we are advised by a planning barrister...) the whole issue.  

 

Because they are not buildings they do not need require planning.  I challenged and challenged that premise and he is adamant.  

the recommendation is to apply to the council (not planning) to get them to accept what we are proposing is not a building and so not bound by planning.  I am so annoyed with the council I don’t want to give them a penny or have them darken our threshold ever again... 
 

The structure on the chassis would be timber /SIPs

 

Effectively you’re putting together a remarkably sturdy raft and building on that.  It’s just that the raft is capable of being lifted with the timber on top of it....
 

let me have a read of Crofter’s blog. 

 

Will also go digging on the chassis (though do find that the main supplier (in Yorkshire) is very very poor at responding (I’ve tried).  So anyone who has better Google fu than I will be bought at least a virtual beer.... 

 

 

 

[ProDave]

First things first, you don't have to build your "caravan" on a wheeled chassis to be a "caravan"  It just has to fit certain dimensions and be capable of being moved, and that can include being lifted by crane onto a low loader.  That is how @Crofter build qualifies.

 

But I think your planning barrister is wrong.  Try getting that statement from him in writing.  If it were really true that you could site and use a caravan anywhere you wanted without planning permission, the green belt would be full of caravan dwellers.

 

There are some exemptions, such as a crofter (A Scottish form of small farmer not the buildhub user in this case) has an automatic right in planning law to have up to 3 caravans on their croft land.  But I assume we are talking here of a residential garden, where you will be limited to a building that falls under permitted development, or one for which planning permission has been granted.

[Temp]

2 hours ago, ProDave said:

But I think your planning barrister is wrong.  Try getting that statement from him in writing.  If it were really true that you could site and use a caravan anywhere you wanted without planning permission, the green belt would be full of caravan dwellers.

 

 

 

No that would mostly be prevented by the rules on "change of use". 

 

You can put a caravan on your driveway or back garden but it's use must be "incidental" not "ancillary" ... 

 

https://plainview.co.uk/news/ancillary-vs-incidental

 

 

Quote

 

Planning Definition

 

There is so much case law examining ancillary/incidental it is difficult to briefly summarise – but in its most basic terms:

 

ANCILLARY (needs planning permission) =  generally anything you (as a person ) could do normally in a standard house as built; e.g. eat, sleep, sit comfortably, pray, study, watch tv, shower.

 

INCIDENTAL (permitted development) = generally everything else. Including storage, swimming, bowling, gym, art studio, or something that can be classed as a hobby. An incidental use is “parasitic” on the primary use- it cannot exist without it. Also ancillary use can be incorporated as long as it’s subordinate to the incidental, i.e. shower room for gym or small bar area- these are seen to not materially extend the normal living accommodation at the property.

 

Edited March 7, 2022 by Temp

[Temp]

So if your plan is to propose a massive caravan under permitted development and at the same time reapply for PP for an extension you should be careful what you call the rooms.

[ProDave]

5 minutes ago, Temp said:

So if your plan is to propose a massive caravan under permitted development and at the same time reapply for PP for an extension you should be careful what you call the rooms.

Similar to us.  When getting the planning for our build, I also got PP for the static caravan as accommodation during the build.  Initially the planners wanted to impose the condition that the caravan be removed upon completion.  I contested that, saying I could remove it, and then immediately replace it under permitted development.  They responded by altering the clause to "residential use of the caravan shall cease upon occupation of the house" which puts it into line with a permitted development caravan that can only be used incidental to the house.

 

Perhaps @Pinzameld might tell us what he wants to actually use his "caravan" for?

[Pinzameld]

thanks guys

 

as for use, larger one is intended to be a garden office/gym 

 

the other one as a utility / craft room (because the planners turned us down we have to lose the one we have to do anything useful internally in the house.  So both ‘incidental usage’. And totally parasitic on the house 

[ProDave]

17 minutes ago, Pinzameld said:

thanks guys

 

as for use, larger one is intended to be a garden office/gym 

 

the other one as a utility / craft room (because the planners turned us down we have to lose the one we have to do anything useful internally in the house.  So both ‘incidental usage’. And totally parasitic on the house 

That's good so both can be built anywhere that the rules allow a permitted development garden building.

 

What building it as a "caravan" will do for you is allow a larger building without the bother of building regulations.  and both can be built as well insulated well constructed buildings and still be a "caravan"

[Galileo]

You asked about a chassis, I came across this awhile ago, might help with your internet searching.

 

Steel Chassis For Log Mobile Homes