WWilts Posted February 23, 2021 Share Posted February 23, 2021 Trades direct or Main Contractor for the build? Context: traditional block & brick cavity wall construction. 200sqm over 2 floors. Not in a position for DIY. Once shell up feel more confident of hiring in trades for internal works / further ground works, landscaping etc. Trades direct or Main Contractor - Which would you choose and why? Project Manager consultant available, fee roughly 7% of predicted build cost OR £90ph. Will also provide their (presumably favourable) trade terms for any trade accounts we set up with builders' merchants. But made it clear that construction risks would remain with us, not with the PM nor the trades. Main contractors / builders - a few interested and available within a reasonable time frame. Some open to agreed target cost with gain share. Some open to contracting one stage at a time (weathertight shell -> internal works -> additional groundworks & landscaping). Trying to decide. What would you do and why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James1994 Posted February 23, 2021 Share Posted February 23, 2021 We are in the middle of a selfbuild, money is tight and not really got a time frame to stick to. But I’ve found that trying to get anyone to come is very difficult, if you use a project manager then they will have all the contacts and will organise everything very efficiently. But it’s gonna cost you . regards James 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToughButterCup Posted February 23, 2021 Share Posted February 23, 2021 9 minutes ago, WWilts said: ... What would you do and why? First, I would think about my own skill set, and the existing demands on my time first so I could make a rough guess at how much time I have for the build , DIY and - or supervision. Whats your time budget ? Want it done pronto, or can you wait? Trades: The key issue (other than Due Diligience) is the hidden networks which exist - normally trades people usually only work with people they know. And if your luck matches the stories we hear on BH, be sure you can take a joke. Contractors: simpler. Does their price suit your budget? Apart from doing Due Diligence, thats about all you need to know. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nod Posted February 23, 2021 Share Posted February 23, 2021 First of all No one needs a project manager to build a house Unless it is enormous What would he do all day He will have contacts But only do the same as a main contractor Ring round and see who is available If you want speed a main contractor may be the route for you But will cost Though not as much as having a PM sat around the place There are some good brickwork contractors that will take on the masonry and put you in contact with the groundwork’s they normally use 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Temp Posted February 23, 2021 Share Posted February 23, 2021 I agree you don't need a full time project manager but it's essential that someone with good organisational skills is part of the team. That could be you, a builder, a project manager, a site foreman or just a good all round trade you can trust. That person should ideally visit the site first and last thing to make sure people are turning up on time and not disappearing early and make sure everyone has what they need for the next day or two. You want to avoid trades turning up then having to go off site to buy essential nails or whatever because it turns into an hour coffee break you are paying for. It would be easy to discover that nobody has ordered something or you are short on materials , find they are on 2 week lead times and then loose a good worker because they have nothing they can do in the meantime. These are project management skills. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWilts Posted February 23, 2021 Author Share Posted February 23, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, James1994 said: trying to get anyone to come is very difficult 47 minutes ago, nod said: Ring round and see who is available 52 minutes ago, ToughButterCup said: hidden networks which exist - normally trades people usually only work with people they know. Strong theme here. PM quote was from someone far away, who would not actually hire trades. Merely advise. So they would be of little use in terms of locating tradespeople. For that route would need to get to watertight stage, and then hire trades as and when available to finish the inside. Food for thought. Nobody yet mentioned construction risk. Defects. Is that a concern when trades are hired direct, each trade blaming the other for defects? Main contractor can be pinned down but not individual trades. Or is that a trivial risk? Many have hired trades direct. Edited February 23, 2021 by WWilts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nod Posted February 23, 2021 Share Posted February 23, 2021 16 minutes ago, WWilts said: Strong theme here. PM quote was from someone far away, who would not actually hire trades. Merely advise. So they would be of little use in terms of locating tradespeople. For that route would need to get to watertight stage, and then hire trades as and when available to finish the inside. Food for thought. Nobody yet mentioned construction risk. Defects. Is that a concern when trades are hired direct, each trade blaming the other for defects? Main contractor can be pinned down but not individual trades. Or is that a trivial risk? Many have hired trades direct. You will always get that regardless of who is overseeing your build A PM won’t take responsibility for defects A main contractor will take responsibility for his subcontractor s Perhaps a good route for your build You will pay a premium for a MC to hand over at watertight though 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWilts Posted February 23, 2021 Author Share Posted February 23, 2021 3 minutes ago, nod said: You will pay a premium for a MC to hand over at watertight though How so? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nod Posted February 23, 2021 Share Posted February 23, 2021 10 minutes ago, WWilts said: How so? Because when you are pricing for a fixed price ALL the unknowns are from the ground up Once watertight the materials and Labour can easily and accurately be calculated The cream 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack Posted February 23, 2021 Share Posted February 23, 2021 5 hours ago, WWilts said: Nobody yet mentioned construction risk. Defects. Is that a concern when trades are hired direct, each trade blaming the other for defects? Main contractor can be pinned down but not individual trades. Or is that a trivial risk? Many have hired trades direct. Very much the case, unfortunately. The classic issue arises at the interface between one trade and another: so the brickies will blame the guys that did the foundations, the window installers will blame the brickies, the plasterers will blame the chippies who built the frame. I don't know how you manage this, other than making sure each trade coming onsite knows what quality of work is expected upfront, and checking that quality as each stage finishes and before you make final payment, so you can get issues sorted before the next trade turns up and starts complaining. More than one BuildHub member has suggested taking recommendations from people whose work you're happy with. The other way around would actually make more sense: have people recommend the trade before them, because they know who'll do a good job that'll make their life easy! Shame houses aren't built in that direction... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWilts Posted February 23, 2021 Author Share Posted February 23, 2021 12 minutes ago, jack said: Shame houses aren't built in that direction... Now that's a thought Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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