Fire regs in a 3 storey house?

[DanielAllen]

Just wondered if anyone knows based on our plans (3 storeys from the front, 2 storeys at the back and side) whether the staircase will now not conform to building regs with it opening out into the kitchen?

Also the windows at the side and rear second floor are floor to ceiling with no openings.

 

Is there any way around this if it doesn't conform?

 

Cheers

0900 - 3D 01_Initial Costing.pdf 0901 - 3D 02_Initial Costing.pdf 0200 - Ground Floor Plan_Initial Costing.pdf 0201 - First Floor Plan_Initial Costing.pdf 0202 - Second Floor Plan_Initial Costing.pdf 0203 - Third Floor-Loft Plan_Initial Costing.pdf

[Temp]

The rules change when you go from two floors to three floors. They require the escape route from upper floors to be protected from fire for 30min. So I'm afraid open plan arrangements on the entry level are a problem in houses with more than one floor above (you have two floors above). A fire in your kitchen could quickly block your exit otherwise.  

 

I think it might be allowed if you install a sprinkler system but I'm not sure if this is an expressly permitted solution in the regulations or if its at the discretion of the Building Control Officer.   

 

https://www.self-build.co.uk/open-plan-layouts-how-overcome-fire-safety-problems/

 

An additional external staircase might also be an option?

 

 

[nod]

I posted a couple of days ago regarding our friends nearing completion of there 5-7 bed home 

Although it looks like a 7 bed Without drastic alteration It will always be a five bed

For the above reasons 

[DanielAllen]

16 hours ago, Temp said:

The rules change when you go from two floors to three floors. They require the escape route from upper floors to be protected from fire for 30min. So I'm afraid open plan arrangements on the entry level are a problem in houses with more than one floor above (you have two floors above). A fire in your kitchen could quickly block your exit otherwise.  

 

I think it might be allowed if you install a sprinkler system but I'm not sure if this is an expressly permitted solution in the regulations or if its at the discretion of the Building Control Officer.   

 

https://www.self-build.co.uk/open-plan-layouts-how-overcome-fire-safety-problems/

 

An additional external staircase might also be an option?

 

 

 

Thankyou

 

If we didn't use the attic do you think we would still need escape routes or fire suppression as it would then be a normal 2 storey house from the rear but still 3 storeys at the front if you include the garage?

[Temp]

I think you should check with Building Control. I doubt they would believe you if you just said  you weren't going to use the top floor. If it didn't exist it might be ok but that seems like a shame to loose what you want for the cost of a sprinkler/mist system.

 

I've got a feeling Wales have made sprinkler systems mandatory in all houses - or was that just a proposal?

 

Edit: looks like they became mandatory for all new houses and flat in Wales from 2016.

Edited January 21, 2021 by Temp

[DanielAllen]

56 minutes ago, Temp said:

I think you should check with Building Control. I doubt they would believe you if you just said  you weren't going to use the top floor. If it didn't exist it might be ok but that seems like a shame to loose what you want for the cost of a sprinkler/mist system.

 

I've got a feeling Wales have made sprinkler systems mandatory in all houses - or was that just a proposal?

 

Edit: looks like they became mandatory for all new houses and flat in Wales from 2016.

 

I agree, i'm going to speak with building control next week and see whay they come back with, definitely the best option I think.

 

Cheers for the help!

[MortarThePoint]

On 21/01/2021 at 12:00, DanielAllen said:

 

I agree, i'm going to speak with building control next week and see whay they come back with, definitely the best option I think.

 

Cheers for the help!

 

Where did you end up with this? I'm wondering about extension options to 3 storey

[kandgmitchell]

On 07/02/2025 at 14:50, MortarThePoint said:

I'm wondering about extension options to 3 storey

Then you need to consider the additional fire precautions as per this from Approved Documents Part B Volume 1 - Fire Safety

 

Loft conversions
2.21 Where a new storey is added through conversion to create a storey above 4.5m, both of the following should apply.
a. The full extent of the escape route should be addressed.
b. Fire resisting doors (minimum E 20) and partitions (minimum REI 30) should be provided,
including upgrading the existing doors where necessary.
NOTE: Where the layout is open plan, new partitions should be provided to enclose the escape
route (Diagram 2.2).

 

[ETC]

You’ll need a protected staircase.

[MortarThePoint]

I think you can avoid upgrading if you have an alternative exit route from the 3rd level (normally a second staircase).

 

I'm sure the kids would go for one of these as an alternative exit route. It's probably similar in price to upgrading all doors inc. glazed door pairs and a glass partition.

 

Wouldn't get it past the boss though.

 

Edited February 9 by MortarThePoint