Can Door & Window fitting shims be removed ?

[Spinny]

Plastic shims were used by the fitters when my doors and windows were put in to position them into the opening and plumb them up and then the frames screwed into the blockwork against the shims and the gaps foamed up.

 

For the external rendering and cladding work I cut the shims back to finish level with the outer frame but did not remove them. My belief being that the doors and windows are effectively braced into position by the shims on one side and the screws on the other.

 

My plasterer has now removed the shims altogether from one side of a door frame (the hinge side) as part of boarding up the reveal. I am now wondering if this might be a problem for the future because it leaves this side of the frame without the shims to help restrict any future frame movement from future years of door opening and closing etc.

 

In many cases the doors and windows also have shims under the bottom cill/frame and people will be standing on these, so would not expect to remove these for the same reason, although I do plan to fill the under cill gaps with foam and/or slivers of blockwork or exterior filler.

 

So should people be removing these shims and might it invalidate any guarantees ?

What is normal here, what is good/bad practice ?

[Mr Punter]

It is normal just to cut them back flush with the frame.  Removal should be difficult as they should be tight and often foamed.

[nod]

They should be cut back before plastering They rarely are 

When I ask plasterers or renderers that work for me Why didn’t you run a saw down the packers They nearly always say the same thing 

“If they can’t be bothered Why should we “

Fitters-Joiners are wasting there time putting them in If they leave them in the way 

[Spinny]

So do I have a problem now because they have been removed not just cut back ?

Shall I  ask for them to be put back to help stop the frame moving in the future ?

[jack]

Shims are designed to counter the weight of a window or door when it's open and not being supported by the latching system. They shouldn't have been removed.

 

Even with shims, we have three or four large door-window frames that have sagged slightly in the direction that the weight of the open door drags the frame. The bottom seals have rubbed and in a couple of cases completely torn off. This might be due to the frames having been under-shimmed, or the shims shrinking over time (our shitty installers used softwood wedges, not plastic). To fix them now will be an absolute pig of a job.

 

It might be less of an issue on the hinge side, but 100% I'd still put them back.

[Spinny]

Thanks Jack. 

Just taken a closer look at the fixings. The frame is made up of 4 pieces of aluminium - top, bottom/cill, and two sides. Each is fixed by screws into the blockwork and seems to have shims adjacent to each screw. The hinge side has 4 fixings - 2 bottom, 1 middle, 1 top. As it happens it is effectively a single pane bifold design, so hopefully designed to be left open.

 

I will say the plastic shims are not always tightly wedged in.

 

I guess I am going to have to call the supplier now to see what they say.