Early days in starting our barn conversion journey

[saveasteading]

1 hour ago, Gone West said:

We had a Klagester Reed Bed System, for six people

That's a commercial digester really. I meant a natural reed bed snaking around and clean enough to end in a pond.

@Gone West what sort of cost was it? I checked it out but found tanks always  much cheaper but less interesting. I'd be interested to know if it looks good, smells, is any concern for children or animals etc. Any maintenance?

[Gone West]

2 hours ago, saveasteading said:

what sort of cost was it? I checked it out but found tanks always  much cheaper but less interesting. I'd be interested to know if it looks good, smells, is any concern for children or animals etc. Any maintenance?

IIRC it was around £2000. It worked fine, no smells, but you wouldn't want children playing in it. The maintenance consisted of thinning out the reeds every three or four years, which you had to be careful when doing, as you shouldn't get the water in any cuts, so it was a Marigolds job.

[fluffnstuff]

On 27/11/2023 at 07:51, IanR said:

 

The Structural surveys completed for planning or paid for by the applicant, who of course is paying for a survey that states the building is capable for conversion.

 

If there's any doubt, I'd suggest you getting your own survey so that you can rely on it. My own LPA is very prescriptive about how much of the original building must remain within the new conversion, and have been known to put a stop notice on a conversion if challenges are met during the build that may change what was stated at the planning stage.

 

What conditions are there on the OP? Brown field sites would normally require a contamination survey prior to commencement. It may get no further than a Stage 1, where there is a desktop search completed and a site walk-over. Has this already been done as part of the planning? If not, it maybe worth getting Stage 1 completed so you know if it highlights any risks that will need to be investigated further. The Stage 2 surveys can cost in the £5K - £10K range, so it's good to know if it needs to be budgeted for, and remedial actions could need a big chuck of budget.

 

Next for me would be assessing the difficulties in getting utilities to the site. Difficult to get costs prior to you owning the site, but if you know your going to have to bring power and fibre 500m across fields, then you need a figure for it in your budget.

Have you investigated the option for re-applying for planning to swap to a knock-down and rebuild? The LPA may consider it, unless the building has historic value. Converting agricultural buildings is typically a compromise that will either cost more to complete or perform poorer than an equivalent new build.

@IanR Sorry I missed replying to this on initial read of the thread. This is amazing advice and great point about the structural survey. All of your points are definitely getting added to our list

 

As for utilities, there is an electricity pole on one diagram in the op but we didn't notice it when we looked at the site. Also I work remotely so internet will be super important.

 

We would rather not apply to knock it down and build again as it's some beautiful features and character that led us to fall in love with it 

[fluffnstuff]

20 hours ago, Gone West said:

I wouldn't say huge. We had a Klagester Reed Bed System, for six people output, it was two tanks, IIRC 2.5m long by 0.8m wide and the BCO sanctioned the tertiary treated effluent to be piped into a soakaway.

 

https://www.kingspan.com/gb/en/products/water-management/reed-beds/

 

 

Ooooh no not big, we have the luxury of space so this is definitely something I would love to learn more about.

 

Did you look at willow beds at all as an alternative to reed? I love the look of reeds but I wonder whether willow has more uses 

[Gone West]

3 hours ago, fluffnstuff said:

Ooooh no not big, we have the luxury of space so this is definitely something I would love to learn more about.

 

Did you look at willow beds at all as an alternative to reed? I love the look of reeds but I wonder whether willow has more uses 

We had a small plot and didn't have room for a drainage field, so we were going to have a deepbore soakaway. The deepbore soakaway turned into a 47m deep well, so we needed another solution. The neatest solution for our needs that we could find, and was acceptable to the BCO, was a Klargester reedbed system. We used the supplied reeds for a year or so but they were very vigorous. We were told we could use irises instead of reeds as they had suitable rhizome root systems and grew less than half the height of the reeds. We never considered willows as they would not have been suitable for the reedbeds we had.

[Gone West]

21 hours ago, saveasteading said:

That's a commercial digester really. I meant a natural reed bed snaking around and clean enough to end in a pond.

Why does a DIY reedbed have to be any larger than a commercial system?

[saveasteading]

20 minutes ago, Gone West said:

DIY reedbed have to be any larger than a commercial system

I can't remember. I just know I tried to make one work a couple of times, and it wasn't viable.

Perhaps it is cautiously specified, as digester soakaways are, whereas a klargester one is a 'thing' with a certificate.

[Alan Ambrose]

Is there not a ditch nearby that you can drain the outfall from packaged treatment plant? By the time it's left the plant it's meant to be guaranteed to be clean enough for this.

[diarmidR]

The Klargester product seems to have similar dimensions to guidelines I've seen elsewhere - 1m2 per person equivalent, and 600m deep gravel.

 

Reed Bed Design Factors - Meniscus

Reed Beds effluent and waste water treatment - Do reed-beds take up a lot of space?

 

This is for tertiary water treatment of course

[diarmidR]

On 30/11/2023 at 12:06, Alan Ambrose said:

Is there not a ditch nearby that you can drain the outfall from packaged treatment plant? By the time it's left the plant it's meant to be guaranteed to be clean enough for this.

Alan, although the manufacturers say that, if the watercourse is not on the OS 25000:1 map then SEPA want the water to go into an additional treatment step: reed bed, partial soakaway or field drain (buried slotted pipe). 

[Alan Ambrose]

>>> is not on the OS 25000:1 map

 

Ah, that's an interesting criterion, thanks for that. I think the equivalent in England for a single dwelling is here:

 

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/general-binding-rules-small-sewage-discharge-to-a-surface-water