Loz Posted November 20, 2022 Share Posted November 20, 2022 Hi, We have just had an extension/renovation project completed and been having problems with one radiator. Have watched a number of videos on balancing the system and had a few goes. Have also been bleeding system like no tomorrow. The one radiator in question was plumbed in a less than ideal way now I look back at it. In between it and the heating system is an ensuite with a high vaulted ceiling, it would have been easy with a few holes to plumb the radiator in the floor but instead ran up far wall of ensuite along top of vaulted ceiling and down to the radiator. No matter what I do I can't get the water flowing in that radiator, the inlet is red hot and when bleeding the radiator can get hot water into it but the outlet never gets hot. Today had my partner filling the system keeping it at 2 bar why I bled the radiator filling 4 2 litre milk cartoons a few times - I do hear air hissing out along with strong jet of hot water but starting to think the air noise is just the noise due to pressure and bleed valve being open as whilst it does ease off have now repeated the above a few times and radiator is getting hotter but not the return flow -think just slowly filling it with hot water that isn't going anywhere. I am thinking there is just not enough power to get the water up over the vaulted ceiling, round the radiator and back up. It would be a nightmare to change the flow as everything tiled (floor, walls), painted etc, there is one possible route but does mean holes in new ceilings and walls and a lot of work but before thinking about that wandered if anyone had any thoughts on anything else missing ? Many Thanks, Loz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyT Posted November 20, 2022 Share Posted November 20, 2022 Turn off all the other radiators on the TRV and get that radiator on fully open on the TRV. put the heating to max/30 deg to make sure it’s pumping out max and try again 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loz Posted November 20, 2022 Author Share Posted November 20, 2022 59 minutes ago, TonyT said: Turn off all the other radiators on the TRV and get that radiator on fully open on the TRV. put the heating to max/30 deg to make sure it’s pumping out max and try again Hi thanks for quick reply, I have had all the rads off at both sides and don't think water has ever been properly circulating but will try again just to be sure, I have dug out a picture of the plumbing in question which is all white speedfit, you can see on left the t junction where at the bottom two out of the T go to the towel rail which works fine, the top two go up and over the vaulted ceiling and down the other side to an h block at the bottom of the rad, is there any way what I would be seeing would happen if the flow and return were crossed into the radiator that isn't working as the installation diagram found for it suggests a flow direction. Kind of hoping this is it as with careful measuring and cutting out the back of a fitted ikea wardrobe and into the plaster board I can get to those T junctions. Many thanks, Lawrence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted November 20, 2022 Share Posted November 20, 2022 If you have pipes going UP and then back down again to a radiator, the high up pipes will just collect any air in the system and form an air lock. If you must have pipes like that, you NEED an automatic air bleed valve on each one at the highest point. Any photos of these high pipes along the vaulted ceiling? If no bleed valve was fitted time to get your plumber back and give him a telling off. I hope there is access to them? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loz Posted November 20, 2022 Author Share Posted November 20, 2022 Pretty sure there are no bleed valves, I can get to the pipes in the attic - possibly not at the highest point though, had read about airlock but thought by having just that rad and trying to force it through would have some joy but guess could be one on the return at the top of the bend as water shoots out when bleeding so no issue on flow, will try original plumber but not been a great journey. Could my thought on flow and return being swapped have any mileage ? Many thanks, Loz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyT Posted November 21, 2022 Share Posted November 21, 2022 Did you try my suggestion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loz Posted November 21, 2022 Author Share Posted November 21, 2022 8 minutes ago, TonyT said: Did you try my suggestion? Trying it right now - turned all rads off this morning and left the troubled one full open and yes did force water through - made lots of gurgling noises and heated up - flow side got hot first and then return so seems is plumbed correctly in terms of flow and return, been turning each rad on in turn with quarter to half turn on one side and TRV to where roughly would want it if everything good, been leaving it a while between each one and trying to do it in order from boiler as far as I understand the plumbing, dreading the troubled one going off, so far so good but have a few of the big ones to got yet which are quite far from boiler, football slowed me down a bit, thanks for help so far and will report back.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyT Posted November 21, 2022 Share Posted November 21, 2022 If you have a modern boiler it may have a modern pump that along with the boiler modulates down so it then makes it harder to get heat to these further radiatiors when the rest f the house is satisfied. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loz Posted November 22, 2022 Author Share Posted November 22, 2022 19 hours ago, Loz said: Trying it right now - turned all rads off this morning and left the troubled one full open and yes did force water through - made lots of gurgling noises and heated up - flow side got hot first and then return so seems is plumbed correctly in terms of flow and return, been turning each rad on in turn with quarter to half turn on one side and TRV to where roughly would want it if everything good, been leaving it a while between each one and trying to do it in order from boiler as far as I understand the plumbing, dreading the troubled one going off, so far so good but have a few of the big ones to got yet which are quite far from boiler, football slowed me down a bit, thanks for help so far and will report back.... 16 hours ago, TonyT said: Did you try my suggestion? Well good news, I now have all the radiators working, the problem one which is a stupid designer radiator I regret buying seems to love to trap air, the bleed valve is at correct end but there were cold patches at other end, did loosen the big nut to let air out, would probably benefit from a bleed valve each end, even now there seems to be parts of it that don't get fully hot, there are thin pipes running up and down at the back and you can feel that not all hot but the radiator as a whole is no longer stone cold, running pressure at 2 - not sure if that is too high but seemed to help overall. Have a slight dread feeling that those high up loops in vaulted ceiling will trap air at some point but for moment it is celebration time ! Many thanks for all the help, Lawrence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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