Changing interpretation of material change of use

[hardya]

We have a property built in 1912 as a semidetached house.  The property has an original built attic bedroom reached by an original second flight of stairs.

The property was converted to two flats in 1945 by building a non supporting wall on top of the hall floor boards and turning the adjacent window into a second door.

We bought the property in 2001 and converted it BACK to it's original intention, a semidetached house, by taking down the wall and turning the door back into a window.

We spoke to the council who said planning permission was not necessary but building regs was relevant because the property had undergone a material change of use and that it must now comply with a subset of the regulations for brand new properties and that given that it was effectively 3 floors, having the original attic room, this included mains connected and linked smoke alarms, a set fire time between floors and and self closing half hour fire doors.

We had no choice but to ensure these were installed.

Probably not relevant, but just to say, our next door neighbor whose property was identical, but had never been changed back TO what it already/originally was, did not have to do this!  Also friends who bought a property which had no record of it's conversion to flats and no record of it's subsequent conversion back to a house were told they did not break the law in not speaking to building regs.

We have since disconnected the mains connected linked smoke alarms in favour of many ordinary ones because they kept going off in the middle of the night, you could not tell which caused it and could not turn them off and no one we got out could fix them.  We also took off the closers because our young children kept trapping their fingers.

We want to now replace our internal doors, but my question is, if we come to sell the house, must we ensure we have half hour self closing doors (hard to get nice looking due to the odd size and super expensive) and mains connected smoke alarms?  Or is there any way around this at all?  Are we in fact already breaking the law by the changes we have reversed while living here ourselves?

I think the self closing plain fire doors may put off viewers and possibly the mains connected linked smoke alarms, if anyone can ever fix them, especially if they proved faulty during a viewing.

Any ideas?  Are there any more recent test cases that say something about going back to ORIGINAL dwelling not being a change?  Or is time since the conversion back a factor? Or has the law changed?  Or any other caveats?

Thanks.

 

P.S.
I know little about this of course, but a quick search finds something which, while it is to do with planning rather than building regs, does suggest that the appeal find that this particular conversion back to the original dwelling of a house was not a material change of use, indicating amongst other things, that impact on the character of the area was a factor, in our case negligible / an improvement, and that there has been a change in the interpretation or emphasis of material change of use since 2014 and also housing policy, iro type of dwelling availability, also I believe not a factor in our case.

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://planningjungle.com/wp-content/uploads/3132022-Appeal-Decision-Notice.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjg_eDMlKrsAhUpSRUIHT_lAnAQFjADegQIAxAB&usg=AOvVaw28Cyij4oZB3AkCAxAs_rfM

 

[the_r_sole]

Planning and building regs are different things altogether so the interpretation of a planning appeal isn't going to give you anything at all for building regs

[ToughButterCup]

6 hours ago, hardya said:

...

  Are we in fact already breaking the law by the changes we have reversed while living here ourselves?

...

If the answer is yes, to what extent does it matter? Who will ever know, unless you tell them, that you have changed the internal arrangements of your house?

The context of your series of questions appears to be related to the possible sale of your house. If that's the case , then there is one overriding concept: caveat emptor.

Edited October 13, 2020 by ToughButterCup

[Mr Punter]

Self closing doors are no longer required in a house, other than between house and a garage.  If they need to be fire resisting they should be FD30.

 

If you have the wiring for smoke detectors it would be a good idea to install them.  I recommend Ei3024 Multi-Sensor Fire Alarms.

[Temp]

9 hours ago, hardya said:

We have since disconnected the mains connected linked smoke alarms in favour of many ordinary ones because they kept going off in the middle of the night, you could not tell which caused it and could not turn them off and no one we got out could fix them. 

 

The normal reason they go off at night is because its the coldest time of day so the battery voltage is lowest. I would suspect a power issue because I had a similar problem..

 

One month after we moved in we were woken up by the alarms chirping about 4am. The indicator light on one alarm said the battery was low so I replaced it. Few nights later another went off. Then a month later the first one went off again. 

 

Our alarms use a 3 core and earth cable for Live, Neutral and Interlink (don't think earth is used). 3 core and Earth cable has cores in Brown, Black and Grey.   Somehow our electrician had forgotten which colour was which and the alarms upstairs were wired differently to downstairs. Swapped the wires so upstairs matched downstairs and it all works perfectly. The incorrect wiring meant they were running on battery all the time.

 

 

 

Edited October 13, 2020 by Temp

[hardya]

On 13/10/2020 at 09:38, the_r_sole said:

Planning and building regs are different things altogether so the interpretation of a planning appeal isn't going to give you anything at all for building regs

 

Ok so "material change of use" as it applies to planning and"material change of use" as it applies to building regs could mean something significantly different even though it's still called "material change of use".

 

Is there any way to get a reconstruction of that?

 

 

[hardya]

On 13/10/2020 at 14:45, ToughButterCup said:

If the answer is yes, to what extent does it matter? Who will ever know, unless you tell them, that you have changed the internal arrangements of your house?

The context of your series of questions appears to be related to the possible sale of your house. If that's the case , then there is one overriding concept: caveat emptor.

 

Re: "caveat emptor" when we sold my mother's property, our solicitor told us that if we "knew" something or "had documents" to indicate something and we did not disclose that to the buyer then we could be liable if an issue arose, it would not be up to the buyer to find out.

 

But if we had NOT done anything to find something out or to get something documented (e.g. got our own survey) then we wouldn't be, it would be up to the buyer to find out.

 

This suggests that we must make changes to (re)meet the building regs, since it is "documented" somewhere that there was a material change of use and if there is an event and the buyer discovers that fact, then we would be liable.

 

This is why I'm wondering if there's a way to get this reconsidered, because it seems odd that it's treated at a development since it's putting it back to what it was.

 

Sorry, if I'm not explaining this well.  It's not an area I really know much about.

 

Thanks.

 

[the_r_sole]

52 minutes ago, hardya said:

 

Ok so "material change of use" as it applies to planning and"material change of use" as it applies to building regs could mean something significantly different even though it's still called "material change of use".

 

Is there any way to get a reconstruction of that?

 

 

 

It's just about the context, the building regs are pretty straightforward in what constitutes a material change of use https://www.designingbuildings.co.uk/wiki/Material_change_of_use

Planning is a whole different ball game and if you're relying on planning appeals which are based around interpretation of case law then you can get down an expensive rabbit hole pretty quickly to make your case...

[hardya]

Thank you, I really appreciate your help.  Looks like I have to bring this work back up to standard then.

I have found fire related text on the site you linked me to, but I am having difficult finding the relevant parts of the fire regulations on the fire building regs where it tells you what you have to do for 3 stories after the change back to a house, if you can help me find it, would be greatly appreciated.

I have found a different more informal text below elsewhere though.

Does one have to comply with regs as in force at the time of the change of use or just now?  I was told at the time you have to comply with building regs for new property, is that right?  The text below mentions new property.    We were told half hour fire doors, but the text I managed to find says FD20, do you think that's right?  This may make it easier to find the right size and look of door.

This text also says you have to install heat sensors in the kitchen, my son had these in a new flat just above the stove and they were a nightmare, just with normal cooking they set off the alarm for the entire building and other occupants used to come out into the vestibule and turn off the whole system and he used to get blamed by the agency for it being turned off.

"For homes of three or more storeys where floors occur 4.5m or more above the outside ground level, egress windows are not an option for fire safety.

In new build three or four storey homes (with a top floor which does not 7.5m above ground level), a protected stairway must be created that is continuous to an external door at ground level. The stairway enclosure throughout should be constructed to be fire resistant for at least 30 minutes, with FD20-rated fire doors (which are resistant for at least 20 minutes) to all habitable rooms along it. Self-closers on these fire doors are no longer a requirement.

Homes with top floors above 7.5m require a second escape staircase or some added protection to compensate, such as a sprinkler system...

...For all structural elements, such as floors, walls and beams, fire resistance of at least 30 minutes is required...

...For new homes and extensions, at least one mains-powered smoke alarm system with detector/alarms interlinked should be fitted on each floor. (Mains-operated smoke alarms should be fitted with batteries as a back-up.) They should be positioned within 7.5m of bedroom doors and located in landings and hallways. Smoke detectors should also be positioned at least 300mm away from pendant lights and from the interface between the ceilings and walls.

Open plan areas which feature kitchens create an added risk. As such, they require the addition of a heat detector/alarm interlinked to the smoke alarm system. Again, these should be positioned at least 300mm away from pendant lights and from the interface between the ceilings and walls..."