Onoff Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 2 minutes ago, Oxbow16 said: The cowshed has solid walls (stone). 550-600mm thick. Guessing no damp course then? Have the original walls been refinished inside and out? High humidity might be linked to these issues. So many things to consider! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxbow16 Posted August 16, 2020 Author Share Posted August 16, 2020 40 minutes ago, Ferdinand said: Two items there .. damp / waterproofing and ventilation. i would be having coughing fits with either of those levels. Short term inexpensive likely fix on that is to put in a PIV loft fan, probably from Nuaire, which will cost about £300 plus installation and should give you a step change in comfort. It will cover a multitude of sins whilst you work out the rest. https://xpress.nuaire.co.uk The sort of things they achieve is instant solution of condensation on singe glazed houses. If your house is in a swamp with external humidity the same as internal it may not help but often the impact can be nearly miraculous. Ferdinand Interestingly, we like open windows a lot, but the humidity tends to go up when we open them. I'll check out the PIV loft fan, thanks I should add that these are extremes, on account of the extreme muggy weather we've been having... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Oxbow16 said: Interestingly, we like open windows a lot, but the humidity tends to go up when we open them. I'll check out the PIV loft fan, thanks I should add that these are extremes, on account of the extreme muggy weather we've been having... it’s about changing the background dynamic by give a constant slow flow of air. I had a property - 40s bungalow with single glazing - where it was not worth doing anything like 2G as it was about to be turned into a road. One cause was that T had 4 Golden Retrievers which gave more moisture load than before, They were having to mop the sills from pools of condensation every day and a PIV just stopped nearly all of that within days. F Edited August 16, 2020 by Ferdinand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxbow16 Posted August 16, 2020 Author Share Posted August 16, 2020 11 minutes ago, Onoff said: Guessing no damp course then? Have the original walls been refinished inside and out? High humidity might be linked to these issues. So many things to consider! There certainly is a lot to consider! And to be honest, I only came here to say hi, I didn't mean for this chat to ensue. Not that I'm complaining No, there's no damp course for the walls. But the concrete slab floor has a DPM beneath. By all accounts that's a bad thing as it sends the moisture to the walls, rather than having a breathing floor. When it comes to tackling that, I'll certainly be back with more in-depth info in a quest for help and advice... Internally, the walls have been painted with a modern paint from what I can tell. Mostly. There is a small section that has been plastered. Externally... The front - I think - is limewashed. The gable end is unfinished, but was repointed with cement mortar instead of lime. The back is unfinished too. Not sure what the pointing on there is... One thing of interest whilst on this subject. (which I'll no doubt repeat in months to come when we actually tackle the room), the house is on a slopping plot front to back. So at the front, I'd guess the internal floor level is quite similar to the external ground. But at the back, the internal floor level is probably around a metre or so higher than the outside ground. I don't know much about buildings, but I have been wondering whether this "one-metre-beneath-internal-floor-level-external wall" somehow helps let the earth beneath the concrete slab breath. In terms of "High humidity might be linked to these issues"... Perhaps. But still interesting as to why the RH is 20% lower than in the room that was built to modern regs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxbow16 Posted August 16, 2020 Author Share Posted August 16, 2020 I just popped the hygrometer outside for interest's sake.... 75% outside. 85% inside (dining room). I guess cutting down on tea and coffee in the adjoining kitchen might help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Oxbow16 said: I just popped the hygrometer outside for interest's sake.... 75% outside. 85% inside (dining room). I guess cutting down on tea and coffee in the adjoining kitchen might help True. But you, the wife, the mistress and the dog also each put out a couple of litres a day. Plus cooking. Plus drying washing if you do. etc. It's about keeping that moving to the outside. Also if you have all that water suspended in the air, you are paying to keep it all warm, which will add to your heating bills. I am sure that there are the calculations somewhere as it is a question asked occasionally. Pulling a punt out of my backside, I would say 10s of £££ per year. F Edited August 16, 2020 by Ferdinand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxbow16 Posted August 16, 2020 Author Share Posted August 16, 2020 3 minutes ago, Ferdinand said: the mistress She puts out the most. And it ain't on account of tea/coffee drinking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxbow16 Posted August 16, 2020 Author Share Posted August 16, 2020 8 minutes ago, Ferdinand said: the dog How could you possibly blame her?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxbow16 Posted August 16, 2020 Author Share Posted August 16, 2020 So that just leaves.... 10 minutes ago, Ferdinand said: the wife, Deal. Yep. I'm happy to blame her Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 4 minutes ago, Oxbow16 said: How could you possibly blame her?? That looks like the type of dog that makes sure you stay fit and trim by eating everything. I can see the smirk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reiver Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 Might it be moisture from cooking that accounts for a lot of the difference then? Without knowing the temperatures and what the external humidity was I wouldn't like to make any other guesses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxbow16 Posted August 16, 2020 Author Share Posted August 16, 2020 My partner's at work tomorrow, and I don't cook I'll stick the kettle in another room and then see how things look after a few hours. I'm presuming humidity from cooking and kettles doesn't hang around for too long... Or does it? Temperature-wise it was around 22-23c when I was taking those readings. And the RH outside was bang somewhere in between at 75% (whilst at the same time the dining room was 85% and the cowshed around mid 60s). Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derek Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 Hi Oxbow, Don't know how far along you are with your sewage treatment plant, if you are yet to choose one stay clear of WTE. Their Vortex range have a noisy air compressor and their Apex/Falcon series are not made by them but by Clenviro as the Matrix at a much lower cost and with excellent after sales unlike WTE who will not even tell you what sort of lifting straps you need to get the tank off the delivery truck. Good luck with the work Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxbow16 Posted August 17, 2020 Author Share Posted August 17, 2020 Hi @derek Thanks for your message. Just to clarify though, I think WTE make the Apex/Falcon, not Clenviro. Clenviro only make the Matrix. Is that what you meant? If not, what makes you say Clenviro make the Apex and Falcon? I'll reply to your other points a little later... Now off to have dinner in my humid kitchen! (Didn't do any testing comparisons of humidity today as it's been peeing down all day!) Ta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derek Posted August 18, 2020 Share Posted August 18, 2020 (edited) Hi Oxbow 16, The Apex which is in fact the Falcon renamed is not made by WTE they simply rebadge the Cleviro Matrix series of tanks and call it their own.. I made the huge mistake of buying an Apex 18 person tank only to find that is a Matrix CLF 3 as confirmed by Tim Cumming of Clenviro. I asked WTE for the EN12566 certificate for the Apex and all they could provide was a CE certificate which of course is not sufficient as it is produced by them not an independent test house. To rub salt in the wound I could have saved 20% by buying the Matrix elsewhere. Even the pictures on the WTE website are the same as Clenviro's web site. WTE are also hopeless at providing any sort of advice on installation, manuals have to be downloaded and nothing is provided with the tank on delivery. Ask James Webb of WTE and he will confirm that Clenviro make the tank for them to resell and he will be unable to tell you of any significant differences between the Apex and the Matrix CLF, also check with Tim Cumming of Clenviro. Edited August 18, 2020 by derek Added text Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxbow16 Posted August 18, 2020 Author Share Posted August 18, 2020 Thanks for the info derek. It's a funny business this sewerage business! That's not the first time I've come to learn that a plant sold by one company is actually made by another and re-badged. Plus there are so many claims that this is best, and everything else is rubbish, because of this, that and the other. And then, to top it all off, there's this guy who seems almost like some dodgy sewerage evangelist! :- https://www.septictank.co.uk/tv/ with all kinds of claims which to my understanding are totally inaccurate. Sorry to hear about your bad experiences. I have had a couple of emails with James Webb and he has been very helpful. I've not bought anything yet though. Looking at the other thread you have written on, I note you've bought twice from WTE, and two different units at that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferdinand Posted August 19, 2020 Share Posted August 19, 2020 (edited) (I'll also drop this post on the other thread) I think two key points amongst others for you are: 1 - If you go for a treatment plant, avoid one where any mechanics are in the goo. When it breaks you will be in deep sh*t, literally. Some bubble air through instead. 2 - Decide whether you want something powered or not, which will help refine your options. We used to have an unusual thing called an Aquatron for our last 15 years at the former house - which was also used in the famous Grand Design in the Cotswolds with the barn supported in mid-air, which was iirc the first Certified PH in the UK. These are easier if you have a bit of height difference (ours was installed usinng a Ha-Ha, GD one had it in the basement). This worked fine for a family house with no odours and clearing out compost like substance once a year - worth a look, There are other possibilities. These are threads you may find as useful background, though a couple of years old: Hope your title hasn't got you propositioned by any coprophiliacs. Ferdinand Edited August 19, 2020 by Ferdinand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxbow16 Posted August 19, 2020 Author Share Posted August 19, 2020 6 hours ago, Ferdinand said: coprophiliacs To my credit, I had to look that one up. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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