Is this side and rear extension Permitted development?

[SBMS]

We are looking at what is possible under permitted development. 

 

As I understand you can build a side extension that projects past the rear elevation 4m without any prior approval, under permitted development.  I understand that if you go more than 4m you need prior approval (shouldn't impact this question).

 

Am currently unsure if building a side extension off the rear elevation (option 1 below) is permitted development, or does this trigger some form of 'wrap around' limitation?  I am pretty sure that option 2 (where the extension only connects to the side wall) is definitely permitted - but is option 1 permitted under PD?  Its technically a side and rear extension but wasn't sure if it needed to expressly not touch the rear elevation wall in order to be PD? @DevilDamo - I know you've commented on a similar one before on the forum, be interested for your take too..

 

Option 1 - building off rear elevation

Option 2 - Only building off side elevation

Edited December 28, 2024 by SBMS

[Marvin]

Hi @SBMS

There's quite a few rules about permitted development.

 

Perhaps a look at this lot will help. It gives other restrictions like what is considered to be the ORIGINAL House.

 

Also your house's history is unknown, is it within any restricted areas, what does the land registry says, ajoining public roads etc. all worth understanding and within this document: 

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5d77afc8e5274a27cdb2c9e9/190910_Tech_Guide_for_publishing.pdf

Edited December 28, 2024 by Marvin

[DevilDamo]

Although I am pretty sure Option 1 would comply, I played it safe with one LPA and submitted Option 2 via a LDC which was agreed. So I’d suggest proceeding with the latter.

[SBMS]

9 minutes ago, DevilDamo said:

Although I am pretty sure Option 1 would comply, I played it safe with one LPA and submitted Option 2 via a LDC which was agreed. So I’d suggest proceeding with the latter.

I tried reading the entire guidance for permitted development (the 60 page guide) and there’s a clear example of option 2. We will be submitting a LDC prior in any event - but is there anything prohibiting option 1 in permitted development rules? It’s still less than half the house width and less than 4m deep…

[SBMS]

13 minutes ago, Marvin said:

Hi @SBMS

There's quite a few rules about permitted development.

 

Perhaps a look at this lot will help. It gives other restrictions like what is considered to be the ORIGINAL House.

 

Also your house's history is unknown, is it within any restricted areas, what does the land registry says, ajoining public roads etc. all worth understanding and within this document: 

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5d77afc8e5274a27cdb2c9e9/190910_Tech_Guide_for_publishing.pdf

Thanks Marvin.  Have read all this, no other conditions like AONB, 50% curtilage etc is all met. Property has brand new PD rights (new build). It’s just option 1 isn’t actually referenced as an example in the tech guide…

[DevilDamo]

25 minutes ago, SBMS said:

I tried reading the entire guidance for permitted development (the 60 page guide) and there’s a clear example of option 2. We will be submitting a LDC prior in any event - but is there anything prohibiting option 1 in permitted development rules? It’s still less than half the house width and less than 4m deep…

Option 2 is as per the top of Page 20 and this is the route I went down. It specifically mentions a side wall and not a rear wall. However, you could argue Option 1 isn’t that dis-similar to the top of Page 25. As LPA’s interpret and read the guidance differently, I didn’t want to risk something along the lines of Option 1 as time was not on our side. However and if time is on your side… try it. Obviously means the client would end up paying two lots of £128.00 plus the PP service charge fees.

[SBMS]

3 hours ago, DevilDamo said:

Option 2 is as per the top of Page 20 and this is the route I went down. It specifically mentions a side wall and not a rear wall. However, you could argue Option 1 isn’t that dis-similar to the top of Page 25. As LPA’s interpret and read the guidance differently, I didn’t want to risk something along the lines of Option 1 as time was not on our side. However and if time is on your side… try it. Obviously means the client would end up paying two lots of £128.00 plus the PP service charge fees.

Do you mean submit both option 1 and option 2 simultaneously as a LDC?

[DevilDamo]

4 minutes ago, SBMS said:

Do you mean submit both option 1 and option 2 simultaneously as a LDC?

You could do but that would definitely result in two applications and two fees, but would be dealt with within 8wks. If you submit Option 1 and that was approved, then you wouldn’t need to do anything with Option 2 along with saving another application and fee.

[Marvin]

Don't forget that fees are expected to rise dramatically very soon....

[SBMS]

When can one submit an LDC out of interest? If the main house is currently under construction does it have to be ‘substantially complete’ before an LDC can be submitted? I understand that PD rights only arise once it is substantially complete, but can an application for an LDC be submitted

earlier?

[DevilDamo]

7 hours ago, SBMS said:

When can one submit an LDC out of interest?

You’ve answered your own question. PD rights and therefore a LDC application to confirm PD proposals come into force upon substantial completion of the property, which is usually BR sign off.

[SBMS]

14 minutes ago, DevilDamo said:

You’ve answered your own question. PD rights and therefore a LDC application to confirm PD proposals come into force upon substantial completion of the property, which is usually BR sign off.

Thanks @DevilDamo  I guess I wondered how much diligence planners take to actually check the status of the build and whether it is in a PD ready state. As planners don’t have access to BR sign off status do they actually take any measures to check this in determining an LDC or just assume it is in this state.. 

[DevilDamo]

18 minutes ago, SBMS said:

Thanks @DevilDamo  I guess I wondered how much diligence planners take to actually check the status of the build and whether it is in a PD ready state. As planners don’t have access to BR sign off status do they actually take any measures to check this in determining an LDC or just assume it is in this state.. 

 

The LDC process will include a site visit. And they may also check the CIL situation as some notices need to be submitted within a certain period after completion.