Octopus, did i imagine this?

[sharpener]

Sorry you are right it is me that cannot add up.

[JohnMo]

17 minutes ago, JamesPa said:

targets cost optimisation with a ToU tarrif at the 'expense' of allowing the house to get up to 2C warmer than the target (which they regard as a minimum). 

 

Couldn't you do that with a smart relay and or a timer thermostat? A lot of heat pumps have a double set point, usually activated via a zero volt contract. I have my heat pump set to 27.1 degs flow, as my base temp for WC and the second set point at 30. WC is normally based on the start point of 27.1, when second point engaged the WC base temperature jumps up to 30 degs.

 

So use a simple timer thermostat, when not calling for heat pump runs at base temperature of 27.1 for WC. When calling for heat runs at base temp of 30 for WC. Thermostat set to 20 during the day (knowing WC normally keeps it at 20.5) and at night (E7 period) it targets 21. That way if I have plenty of solar gain in the day I am not running the house too hot.

 

So during cheap periods, use the thermostat to ask for a higher temperature activating the second set point. Also use a smart relay to activate second set point when producing xkW from PV, battery is above x SOC (state of charge) and outside temp is below x degs. Simple home assistant automation.

 

When the sun's out and battery is pretty much charged I can buffer the floor for a couple of hours for free, when in E7 period I also buffer the floor.

[JohnMo]

45 minutes ago, JamesPa said:

 

 

Edited October 25 by JohnMo
Ignore

[PhilT]

3 hours ago, JamesPa said:

The spreadsheet assumes 50% export in all scenarios, thats the allocation to sub-tarrif D.

The base Cosy calc at the moment uses the % hour split but it matters not - it's just another scenario. Interesting to play around with the numbers

Edited October 25 by PhilT

[JamesPa]

1 hour ago, PhilT said:

The base Cosy calc at the moment uses the % hour split but it matters not - it's just another scenario. Interesting to play around with the numbers

So it does.  I probably was thinking that I couldn't easily apportion between the various rates given that they are somewhat interleaved, although the probability of Solar displacing consumption in the peak rate period is relatively low.  In reality a better model might be 50% exported (at 15p) and the rest apportioned.  If I plug that in Cosy without battery becomes about £90 less attractive.

Edited October 25 by JamesPa

[sharpener]

On 25/10/2024 at 14:28, JamesPa said:

I do wonder whether their long term goal is to be bought out by Octopus and integrated into Kraken.  

 

On 25/10/2024 at 14:57, sharpener said:

Since Octopus bought out RED 2 yrs ago and are already producing their own (hideous) 6kW unit (having binned most of RED's innovative ideas) I would guess they are a long way down this integration path.

 

The process seems to be well under way. Found this interesting quote from HVP magazine 10/7/24. Not sure I like the way they are getting into bed with DNOs to conspire against the publick ((c) Adam Smith).

 

Octopus Energy’s Kraken software already provides optimisation for its Cosy 6 heat pumps, which it manufactures itself, and for Daikin models through that company’s API. Octopus says it is also working to integrate with Mitsubishi, Vaillant, NIBE, and Samsung and hopes to make a series of announcements by this winter.

 

Alex Schoch, Octopus Energy’s Head of Flexibility, explains that while optimisers have so far done a “fantastic job” of cutting costs for individual customers, they will soon have to become even more sophisticated.

That’s because the rapid take-up of heat pumps could stretch the capacity of local electricity grids, meaning that optimisers will need to take account not only of the needs of an individual home but also the balance of electricity supply and demand in the neighbourhood.

 

Octopus already does this through contracts with Distribution Network Operators (DNOs) who need to reduce demand during peak hours in areas where local grid capacity is tight. These commitments influence how Kraken optimises individual Octopus heat pumps, EV chargers and batteries, but the company insists that customer comfort is always the top priority.

 

Indeed, the company argues that by helping to relieve local grid congestion, heat pump owners will earn further financial benefits."

[JohnMo]

Big brother is here and working. Even starting to control your heating system. Slippery slope.

 

Think I will stay with my dumb E7 and have control myself.

[SteamyTea]

If 3 business men meet in a room and fix higher prices, it is called a cartel, and illegal.

If 3 similar software systems do the same, it is a cartel.

[JamesPa]

4 hours ago, JohnMo said:

Big brother is here and working. Even starting to control your heating system. Slippery slope.

 

Think I will stay with my dumb E7 and have control myself.

I can't decide whether I violently agree or violently disagree.

 

It's clear that, as we electrify, there are real opportunities (and a need) for grid demand management which probably are best managed centrally not locally, and equally clear that the new infrastructure costs, which ultimately we all have to bear, will be enormous if we don't manage demand.

 

On the other hand, like you, I value independence.

 

My considered view is that we need infrastructure build out and demand management that acts solely in the public interest, not commercial interest.  But we also need the option to opt out of demand management. However if you do opt out of demand management then you should bear the full cost including making a significant personal contribution to the infrastructure in addition to any contribution through tax.  That will translate to very high electricity charges if you don't want demand management, but so be it.

 

With a bit of luck that should focus minds on what matters individually in a way that doesn't prejudice choices others may wish to make 

 

Edited October 30 by JamesPa