UPVC Verge to underside of slate and facia area?

[ruggers]

Is it good or bad practice to install UPVC gable end barge boards up flush with the top of the batten so it meets the underside of the slate, rather than have a cement board cloaking and mortar pointing? One roofer says the mortar method is best to add weight to the ends and helps when it's windy.

I'd rather avoid mortar if possible, it's more future maintenance and cost with it being a 9m high ridge. I'll have a 200mm soffit and verge overhang all around and 40-50mm slate over hang.

 

I planned to fit slates but have been looking to reduce costs so considering some rivias clay tiles for my self-build roof. I much prefer the look of slate because I don't like the look of individual dry verge caps and have been told the 3m long strips can warp. Both usually fade too. I want it to be as low maintenance as possible so I'm not having to pay for upkeep of mortar verges or replacing caps.

 

1. Does anyone have any advice on dry verges that are good quality if I go with tiles?
2. Is it ok to have UPVC to the slate underside and should it be CT1 sealed where the two meet?
3. How can I avoid having the weight of slate or tiles on the facia boards, are tilt fillets still used or is there something better thats nailed to the rafters and offers better air circulation?

 

[EdHat]

Although it is not unusual to see slates laid onto the barge board with no undercloak and mortar, you should bed all tiles or slates on an undercloak or use a dry system.

I agree dry verges made up of individual caps do not look nice.

A wet bedded verge isn't that much maintainance if done correctly. Make sure the undercloak is bedded, projects the right amount and tiles are bedded on a min 100mm wide bed of mortar. Often tiles are bedded and mortar is left recessed and pointed up after, and then that falls out.

If done right, by the time it needs looking at plastic dry verges would be faded and looking poor.

Bear in mind if, you are considering interlocking tiles each will need to be clipped at the verge which effects the aesthetics of a bedded verge.

 

1. There are continuous dry verges available for tiles. I would avoid darker plastics to delay the fading.

2. With slate, if you don't want to bed them just use a continuous dry verge, they look very neat imo.

3. At the eaves? Why don't you want weight on the fascia? You can use an over fascia vent to provide ventilation between the fascia and tile/slate. Some roofers still use tilt fillets with 5u felt but eaves support trays are generally more popular now. This is to support the underlay not the tiles/slates though. If you don't have a fascia you would need a tilt fillet to support the tiles/slates.

 

[joe90]

4 minutes ago, EdHat said:

A wet bedded verge isn't that much maintainance if done correctly.

I used to use plaster beading nailed to the ends of the battens to act as “rebar“ in the mortar and stop it cracking and falling out, never had a call back.

Edited May 14 by joe90

[ruggers]

I'm familiar with slating and done a bit myself but I'm not familiar with tiles. Even though I won't be installing the slate or tiles, I want to understand the options so that I can find an installer who will do it that way. I liked the idea of slates with no undercloak and the facia up to the underside because it effectively zero maintenance. Having to get repointing done, even in 20 years, is the expense of 3 gable scaffolds up to 9m high or paying someone however much that costs for the time if it can be done from a ladder.

 

The only difference I can think of with the facia to slate, no mortar option, is the slate 40mm over hang gets caught by the wind and could eventually come loose?

 

On 14/05/2024 at 17:19, EdHat said:

Make sure the undercloak is bedded, projects the right amount and tiles are bedded on a min 100mm wide bed of mortar. Often tiles are bedded and mortar is left recessed and pointed up after, and then that falls out.

What do you mean by undercloak being bedded? Mine will be on a gable ladder which provides a 200mm soffit. If I'm correct, a 150mm wide undercloak would normally installed on top of the gable ladder and barge board, held tight under the tile batten and secured by clout nail into the rafter, and then 40-50mm of the undercloak projects past the bargeboard with the slate? The battens and breather membrane need to be set back enough so they don't wick moisture from the verge mortar. Then once the roof is completed all of the verge is pointed up in one run?

On 14/05/2024 at 17:19, EdHat said:

Bear in mind if, you are considering interlocking tiles each will need to be clipped at the verge which effects the aesthetics of a bedded verge.

The clay tiles I looked at (Sandtoft rivius), as you mention, theydo say they need to be clipped on every row at the verges. Are these clips visible from the outer edge, and can't be hidden if using a pointed wet tile verge to avoid using dry the systems? 

The tiles would have to be black so the verge caps would have to match.

If using slate, It will be purple/black Welsh with anthracite UPVC.

On 14/05/2024 at 17:19, EdHat said:

3. At the eaves? Why don't you want weight on the fascia? You can use an over fascia vent to provide ventilation between the fascia and tile/slate. Some roofers still use tilt fillets with 5u felt but eaves support trays are generally more popular now. This is to support the underlay not the tiles/slates though. If you don't have a fascia you would need a tilt fillet to support the tiles/slates.

I was just told by a joiner when we done my current house facias and roof, that it's bad practise to have the weight of slates on the facia and makes it really hard to replace the facia again because your trying to lift 5m of eaves slates when nailing to the rafter ends. Where as if it's supported by other means on the rafters, like a tilt fillet, it's better. Ultimately I'll have to comply with building regs and require eaves ventilation anyways.

[ruggers]

@joe90 Sounds a good shout that with the metal trim. Just slid between the battens and undercloak then tacked to the ends of the rafters.