Am I reading the planning guidance correctly?

[Dilvid]

Hi there,

 

Just starting to look at designing/querying what we want to do for an extension to our house. Bit of back story first, we own a detached house with a fair bit of land around it on a bog standard estate. The gist is that originally our plot was meant to have two houses on it but they decided not to which means we basically have a plot and 3/4 resulting in a driveway we can park 8-9 cars in, detached double garage (a double garage width away from the house) and the left side of the house (as facing it) has enough room to park a caravan and a car side by side (which the previous owners used to do) along with a fair decent sized back garden too.

 

Now, our ideas/dream of the extension was a bit of a big one. Side and Back wrap around two floor extension. Aim would be go out to the side about 3 metres and to the back about 2-3 metres too. Now, I've done some searching and come up with the usual sponsored architect websites and YouTube videos of people saying what they did, and then trying to peice it together for what we wanted.

 

I went to the government site and according to one of their guidances it says that a rear extension cannot go past the width of the existing house. If that is the case, how can you have a wrap around extension? Does anyone have any experience/had a wrap around extension?  Is it one of these you can do it but require planning permission and the PD doesn't cover it? and the rule I spotted was for PD?

[ProDave]

I suspect the guidance you were looking at is what is allowed under permitted development.  A true wrap around extension would need planning permission.

 

Perhaps you can post a sketch of the plot layout and what you want.

 

Are you sure you are not missing a trick here?  Double garage, spaced a double garage width from the house, is going to be about 15 metres wide.  Plenty to build another house.

[Temp]

+1 

 

The guide here https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/permitted-development-rights-for-householders-technical-guidance tells you what you can build without needing planning permission. If you want to build something that doesn't meet the above you need to apply for planning permission.

[Dilvid]

On 08/07/2022 at 16:20, ProDave said:

I suspect the guidance you were looking at is what is allowed under permitted development.  A true wrap around extension would need planning permission.

 

Perhaps you can post a sketch of the plot layout and what you want.

 

Are you sure you are not missing a trick here?  Double garage, spaced a double garage width from the house, is going to be about 15 metres wide.  Plenty to build another house.

Sorry taking an age to reply, 5 kids....think that's all I need to say ha!

 

I know what you mean but the garage is set forward of the house. I've taken the existing design of the house and put it into some terrible tool I found (planning on converting it into Sketch or something when I have time). You can see the building in front of the house. That is the garage and the small room on it is a bit of a tool shed. I've included the 'proposed' plan drawing line too which shows where we would want to extend up to (so you can see it compared to the footprint of the land).

[efkor]

It is possible to achieve an "almost wraparound" under Permitted Development by positioning a gap between side and rear extension. I describe this in one of my YouTube videos (
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_2W-RZ-RioY).

 

However, there is an important caveat and it is best described by this extract from a Planning Appeal report from a Planning Inspector:

"It is clear from reading the Stanbury Avenue Appeal Decision that the Inspector
considered the gap of 5 centimetres between a pre-existing rear and side
extension was clearly a device used to avoid making a planning application for
the proposed development."

Appeal Ref: APP/T0355/X/18/3211902 (it can be read by logging in at https://acp.planninginspectorate.gov.uk/)
 

 

[Temp]

I had a look at your plans and would have a rethink...

 

You are extending sideways 2.57m probably giving a room only 2.2m by the time you subtract the thickness of the walls. They are also on the side which already has small rooms like the WC and Utility Room. Are you planning to knock through into the extension to make them bigger? 

 

Likewise the rear extension. You suggest 2-3m. Seems like a lot of work for just 2m unless you are planning to knock through. A knock through at both back and sides is possible but it's quite expensive and you certainly need a builder that's done it before due to the risk. A structural engineer also needed.

 

I think I would look at a wider side extension so rooms there are big enough without a knock through?  And perhaps a deeper conservatory or sun room on the back of the kitchen/dining room under Permitted DeDevelopmentas it's detached you can extend back 4m no problem and upto 8m 8f neighbours are happy under the consultation scheme.

[Dilvid]

20 hours ago, Temp said:

I had a look at your plans and would have a rethink...

 

You are extending sideways 2.57m probably giving a room only 2.2m by the time you subtract the thickness of the walls. They are also on the side which already has small rooms like the WC and Utility Room. Are you planning to knock through into the extension to make them bigger? 

 

Likewise the rear extension. You suggest 2-3m. Seems like a lot of work for just 2m unless you are planning to knock through. A knock through at both back and sides is possible but it's quite expensive and you certainly need a builder that's done it before due to the risk. A structural engineer also needed.

 

I think I would look at a wider side extension so rooms there are big enough without a knock through?  And perhaps a deeper conservatory or sun room on the back of the kitchen/dining room under Permitted DeDevelopmentas it's detached you can extend back 4m no problem and upto 8m 8f neighbours are happy under the consultation scheme.

Yes, we are planning to knock through (attached is the planned layout). The main aim is to get the kitchen bigger and give more bedrooms (my wife and I plan to move into the loft space and then with some moving round of internal walls it would create 6 bedrooms on that floor, technically turning the house into a 7 bed house, 4(or 5, haven't decided on layout properly on first floor) bath house). 

 

I know now we are defiantly having to get planning permission which is fine. I presumed we would in the first place with it being a two story extension.
 

Does anyone know the rules around re-building a roof? This extension will obviously change the footprint of the house so we thought we would just rebuild the roof to the larger size (keeping the height of the brick work etc as per rules). I think we would be higher on the top of the roof a tad just because of the pitch of the roof but I don't think it would be too bad as the fact is the houses on the estate are all different heights (being different designs and some are even three story anyway).

[Temp]

What's your budget? It's about 90 sqm of extension. At say £2000/Square meter is £180,000 - £200,000. But I could be underestimating it.