South Cambridgeshire Local Authority, yay/nay?

[Tony L]

12 hours ago, Gus Potter said:

The building industry is not full of nice folk.

This has been my experience so far.

 

12 hours ago, Gus Potter said:

I'll catch the fu.ker and have his house off him if I can

 

Good for you.  Show no mercy.

[saveasteading]

12 hours ago, Gus Potter said:

designs that I've checked and found them wanting as they are incompetent and downright dangerous. 

Sadly I'm not surprised.

Eg. I was once seconded to one of the big UK  consultants who were engaged by one of the world's biggest (US).

I was handed stuff to design that I had only studied af student level. I thought "why me" then gradually realised that the place was full of agency sourced designers and I knew as much, maybe more, than most of them.

It was basically " design this middle eastern new city".

I did ask at higher level and was told not to worry as it will all be redone later.

I've looked on Google Earth and it seems to be in place.

 

On the positive side though, this became part of a spontaneous and rigorous questioning at my Professional Interview. It was clear that this was also a concern to my interviews, both high in Engineering circles, so perhaps it is unusual.

Plus I've engaged perhaps 5 Stuctural Engineering practices over the years. No doubts, good teamwork.

 

The thing is, @Gus Potter, if they are found wanting what will happen to them? They aren't in professional bodies that could sanction them, so prob a strict talking to and small fine, and then a change of business name.

 

 

[Gus Potter]

On 08/05/2026 at 12:59, saveasteading said:

The thing is, @Gus Potter, if they are found wanting what will happen to them? They aren't in professional bodies that could sanction them, so prob a strict talking to and small fine, and then a change of business name.

This is an important question. 

 

To address this I go back to the HSE act 1974. This was a vital piece of legilation as it made breach of the act a criminal offence. Jumping quickly ahead we had the CDM regulations 2015 which in part also reinforced the statutory stiffness. In other words it means you can't go about desinging or carrying out work if you are not competant to do so.

 

In the UK It's got little to do with if you are a chartered member of x, y and z. All that does under UK law is to help you demonstrate competancy. Competancy can be demonstrated in different ways. The law is a good law as it is all emcompassing. There are many Engineers and Designers (lots of these work for and are involved in Contracting where we are looking for experience and competancy) they are not chartered but many also have a deep understanding of boots on the ground Civic responsibility. So no, being Chartered does not make you better or more qualified, it just shows you have attained something, through a process that demonstrates your competancy. That is the law. 

 

I refer to a well known goetech book, its the go to bible. The guy that wrote it was a director of a massive Scottish Structural Engineering Consultancy.. he had an HND in Civil Engineering, he wasn't a chartered SE or anything. But many well known Chartered Engineers were glad to get a mention. 

 

The reasoning behind the law was to capture all the tom, dick and harrys.. say dodgy plumbers and moonlighting "Architects" or tech designers, builders that thought they could do design that were desinging stuff that was unsafe to build or later compromise the safety of a building. 

 

The actual problem is that the law as it stands is not being enforced. All the tools are there that would allow our courts to send people to prison for statutory breaches of the law.

 

Next is the Civil Law aspect. Now to practice well you also should to hold indemnity insurance. If you employ anyone then you must have employers liability insurance as that is a statutory requirement, public liability insurance is an optional extra. PI insurance is also and extra believe it or not!

 

Technically you can practice in the UK with no PI insurance! It's totally irresponsible but some who moonlight do so.. I hold 2.0 million PI insurance as an SE and Architectural designer which is a lot more than most small Architects and small SE's for example. My cover is wide ranging. 

 

So what needs to happen is that the law as it is stands needs to be enforced for everyone that does any kind of design work. We need to see some prison sentences dished out from the local plumber right up to the Architect and SEs when they put folks safety at risk.  

 

 

 

Edited May 12 by Gus Potter

[saveasteading]

7 hours ago, Gus Potter said:

prison sentences

That doesn't even happen for gross incompetence with lives lost.

To me, the PI I had to pay was firstly an assurance for every client, and secondly it was in case of any inadvertent error by my business or a sub-contractor or engaged specialist designer.

It didn't occur to me that we, or anyone,  might be incompetent... ie only do what you know and do it well.

Part of the training is to appreciate all aspects and know enough that you don't dabble.

Eg a surgeon doing hip surgery knows a lot about cardiology but doesn't dabble with heart surgery.

 

Fundamentally a dabbling and overconfident builder  or a rogue designer probably goes out of business after a very big mistake, but some poor client is left with the consequences.

[Gus Potter]

On 13/05/2026 at 08:08, saveasteading said:

That doesn't even happen for gross incompetence with lives lost.

Sadly this is the case, you make a very good point. 

 

On 13/05/2026 at 08:08, saveasteading said:

It didn't occur to me that we, or anyone,  might be incompetent... ie only do what you know and do it well.

This statement in it's self demonstrates one the key aspects of competency. "only do what you do well" it shows risk awareness and competency from yourself, a key skill. 

 

On 13/05/2026 at 08:08, saveasteading said:

Fundamentally a dabbling and overconfident builder  or a rogue designer probably goes out of business after a very big mistake, but some poor client is left with the consequences.

This is also sadly true. 

 

The following are some of my thoughts on what you might want to ask of a builder, SE, Architect etc before entering into a contract. The easiest way is to you use myself as an example. 

 

There is a member on BH that has a large swimming pool project. Now for me there is not enough demand in Scotland say for these. Each year I have to renew my PI insurance and fill in huge amounts of questionnaires, provide financial data and so on. One of the forms is to do with swimming pools, they carry high risk for the underwriter. Swimming pools are excluded from my policy.

 

Now if I had 10 swimming pools come along in a row then I can go back to my insurer and ask how much to bring this under cover. They are going to say.. no chance unless you can demonstrate competency. My insurer's are there to make money. But if put together a proposal to say.. well it's like a basement..(but filled with a corrosive solution, high humidity etc.. hazards abound!) here is what I'm good at.. can you cover the rest.. while I learn, as every one has to do, they would probably say Ok but it's going to cost you. That cost gets spread over the ten jobs. They would also look at my track record and say.. Gus seems to know what he is doing, has been a Client for a long time wqith n0o claims so let's take on a bit of extra risk and charge Gus accordingly. 

 

The point of the above is that unless you ask a builder, SE or Architect just what they are insured for and what the amount of cover is then if something goes wrong  then what @saveasteading says.. is unfortunatley true. 

 

This is often a difficult / uncomfortable question for a Client to ask at the beginning of the project when everyone is getting along fine. I'm quite happy if a Client asks me for the details of my PI cover, exclusions and so on, transparency is healthy. What I can't do is disclose the financials (really detailed stuff) that are confidential between the insurer and my self. To do so would void the cover. 

 

On 13/05/2026 at 08:08, saveasteading said:

Part of the training is to appreciate all aspects and know enough that you don't dabble.

In some ways yes, agree.. do not dabble, that's dangerous. 

 

That said. For me I'll often take on a design that is outwith the standard design codes. Here I go back to first principles.. that I'm competent in and build the design from there. There are lots of folk that are doing really innovative stuff on Build Hub. Often the only way to justify this is to go back to first principle design. 

 

In some ways all domestic Clients have a level of protection under the consumer protection act. There is a fundamental duty of care that applies to anyone that does work on your house or provides professional services. I think if the law as it stands was enforced properly it would discourage traders and professionals from hiding behind a limited liability company. 

 

To finish with a bit of a story. When I was a builder I had a sub contractor who was an elder in the Church of Scotland but also had made a lot of money when he was younger as an electrictian working on Gerald Ratner's shops. That was the guy that blew the buisiness when he stood up and said he had made his millions selling rubbish. From time to time he used to give me and the lads the benefit of his approach. He said "the truth will set you free". Now this is absolutely true to this day for people working in business. Being truthful will lose you some jobs.. but in the long run you'll win more, you will also win jobs even though your are not the cheepest!