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Permitted Development behind a side extension and/or near an outbuilding


elrao
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Hi

I am trying to get an idea for what might be possible under PD for a house I am looking at buying.  The house has a double-storey side extension that was completed in 1993 (with planning permission) that extends by approx 90cm from the rear of the original house.  There is a 4m conservatory built to the rear (under permitted development) and a detached double garage approx 5m from the rear of the house (in line with the corner) that has a dual pitched roof (higher than 2.5m).  So we start from something like the first attachment.

                                       

We are looking to build a single-storey extension to the rear of the property under permitted development (as the house is on Green Belt, so PD is the only realistic option).  My understanding is that the rules about rear extensions under PD would allow me to remove the conservatory and build "back" the full width of the original house by 4m (8m with neighbour consultation); however I have two questions:

 

1) Is the location of the garage (i.e. an outbuilding) an issue as it is more than 2.5m high?

 

 My understanding is that if I were to build an outbuilding within 2m of the original house, then it should not exceed 2.5 in height, however does the same apply if extending to within 2m of an existing outbuilding?  Assuming it does, then I would either have to ensure the extension remains 2m from the garage, or move the garage!

 

2) What rules apply to the bit between the "side" extension and the "rear" extension (shown on the second diagram)?

 

I assume this would be considered a side extension (as it is not directly behind the original house).  However I can't see mention of whether the side extension can go beyond the rear of the original house or not (like the current one already does). 

 

Thanks in advance :)

PTF Now.png

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Thanks @Marvin

 

More complex than I though, good job I will be using an architect / planner when the time comes!

 

I see there is a section on "Side wall extensions extending beyond rear walls" (p20).  If I understand this correctly, then a side extension that is not attached to the original rear wall can extend beyond the rear wall of the house, and the bit that does is to the same limitations as a rear extension.   At the moment the side extension is double-storey between the front and rear of the original house, with the small (1m ish) part, that extends beyond the original wall, being single storey. 

 

From what I am seeing, I could leave the conservatory as it is, and extend the existing side extension further to the rear.  If I understand what it is saying on page 21, then even though this part would be single-storey it would be governed under the rules of a double-storey extension as it forms part of the overall side extension which is principally double-storey in nature.  In this case it would be limited to 3m.

 

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Page 27 & 28 seems to then cover my scenario.

 

What is shown by A could be considered the existing extension, further extended to 3m from the rear wall.  I could not add B (whether single storey or double storey) as by joining the two together, they would consider the rear extension to now extend beyond the side wall and so the whole rear extension would be subject to the side extension rules as well (i.e. max width = 50% of the whole house).

 

I think, I could therefore extend to the rear as long as it doesn't join the side extension (principal applied to the conservatory), so could possible combine an extension to the side extension AND a rear extension, as long as they don't join each other...?

 

Haven't seen anything yet about the proximity of the existing garage.

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How wide is the green extension? The grey "PD here" is limited to half the width of the house..

 

Page 22...

(j) the  enlarged  part  of  the  dwellinghouse  would  extend beyond a  wall  forming  a side  elevation  of  the  original  dwellinghouse,  and would

 (I) exceed  4 metres in  height,

(Ii) have more than  a single  storey, or

(Iii) have  a  width greater  than half  the  width of  the  original  dwellinghouse

Edited by Temp
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1 hour ago, elrao said:

1) Is the location of the garage (i.e. an outbuilding) an issue as it is more than 2.5m high?

 

 My understanding is that if I were to build an outbuilding within 2m of the original house, then it should not exceed 2.5 in height, however does the same apply if extending to within 2m of an existing outbuilding?  Assuming it does, then I would either have to ensure the extension remains 2m from the garage, or move the garage!

 

I'm not sure if that's a hard rule. Some people have built outbuildings close to their house and  the planners have won and lost appeals. They use words like "there must be a material gap" without defining what that is.

 

One option is to submit plans with an Application for a Certificate of Lawful Development. This would be checked against the rules for Permitted Development rather than the more subjective Planning Policies that a Planning Application has to meet.

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2 hours ago, elrao said:

 My understanding is that if I were to build an outbuilding within 2m of the original house, then it should not exceed 2.5 in height, 

 

I think that might be being confused with..

 

https://www.planningportal.co.uk/info/200130/common_projects/43/outbuildings

 

Maximum height of 2.5 metres in the case of a building, enclosure or container within two metres of a boundary of the curtilage of the dwellinghouse.

 

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20 minutes ago, Temp said:

How wide is the green extension? The grey "PD here" is limited to half the width of the house..

 

Page 22...

(j) the  enlarged  part  of  the  dwellinghouse  would  extend beyond a  wall  forming  a side  elevation  of  the  original  dwellinghouse,  and would

 (I) exceed  4 metres in  height,

(Ii) have more than  a single  storey, or

(Iii) have  a  width greater  than half  the  width of  the  original  dwellinghouse

 

Good point, I was going on the assumption it was half the width, as it looks about that by eye,  but have not actually checked (was done with PP). 

 

Looking at that PP, the side extension is shown as 4.7m wide (internally), but it annoyingly doesn't have the dimensions of the original house.  Google maps + the floorplan indicate total width is somewhere around 15m, so original house would have been around about 10m.  So it does look like the current extension is about 50% width, but will need to check with a tape measure!

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I don't follow.  I get that everything is in relation to the original size of the building, and everything I have stated is in line with this (and the diagrams subsequent that show the original house in blue).

 

What am I missing, which part of my understanding is wrong?

 

 

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7 minutes ago, Temp said:

 

I think that might be being confused with..

 

https://www.planningportal.co.uk/info/200130/common_projects/43/outbuildings

 

 

 

 

Hi

 

Yes, there is that - but I thought I also saw something about the max height of the outbuilding considering the distance from the main house.  Could have been confused by the terms used elsewhere.  If not then I don't have to worry about where the existing garage is :)

 

It only becomes a problem if we wanted to go for prior approval to go bigger than 4m (and over 5m), as the extension would potentially connect the garage!

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3 minutes ago, Marvin said:

Sorry @elrao you caught me when busy. I meant to say best to check all the document (which it looks like you may have already done)

 

Good luck

 

M

I can't say I read it word for word .... :)

 

I did have a good flip through though, was VERY helpful, so thank again @Marvin for sharing it

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