gac Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 (edited) Hi everyone, I have a small question regarding the operation of the mixing valve with this device series, I see there are a lot similarities with the Gen6 folks, maybe this one is, I'm not totally clear on this. Operationally and performance wise, I'm very happy, it's producing all the heat needed for our not-super isolated home, which is a mix of underfloor heating and radiators. There are some downsides though, like it's unable to operate at low performance when the weather is +18c and causing cycling, but there are ways around it. It seems it needs a minimum of 2kw consumption to function "normally". I assume this will always be the case related to heatpump sizing. This is a self install, replacing a gas boiler, about 2 weeks ago right before it started getting a bit more chilly. Regarding the issue. My conclusion is that there must be some incompatibility with the mixing valve actuator I'm using (ESBE ARA641), though I'm still in disbelief and before I chase the one mentioned in the manual, I wanted to check with you guys if I missed anything. I'm using this valve for the UFH (WL1 25-35°) to mix down the temp needed for the radiators (WL2 45-55°). Currently it's set manually, this valve has a manual override, as to not overheat the UFH. So the problem is that the valve is either full to the left (CCW) (0% mix) or full to the right (CW) (100% mix). Depending on how it's wired up. If according to the manual CCW and CW correctly then it's the first, always full to the left, 0% mix and just getting the full blast of the temperature meant for the radiators. With the self-test it will move in the opposite direction, so I know control is possible, just not why it's not chasing the target WL1 values. The TW4 sensor is placed where it should be and in controls you see the mix valve temp be much higher or lower than where it should be. The field service settings 4041, relating to mixing valve, is set to follow water law and running time 60sec, as per the device's manual. As a test I set WL1 to 25-25 and WL2 45-45 so the mixing valve should always mix down 20° lower. And even though the TW4 sensor clearly states mix valve outlet 37°, it should be moving the valve CW to mix down the temperature with the UFH return. And so here we are. edit: I've also tested the delta t setting in 4041 and set to 20° but same result, valve always full to the left ccw and 0% mix, full WL2 temp in correct wiring mode. And regarding the 37°, it's in a manual mix setting, and when I check where the actuator is positioned, it's still at full ccw, 0% mix. If it's really just an incompatible mixing valve actuator, I would be really surprised, but I'm open to purchasing one that does function correctly. Though those mentioned in the manual were not so easy to find.. heatpump manual: https://downloadcenter.samsung.com/content/UM/202307/20230724171125643/EHS_R-32_MONO_OUTDOOR_IM_EU_DB68-11904A-03_EN.pdf control kit manual: https://downloadcenter.samsung.com/content/UM/202011/20201130093011491/DB68-08471A-03_IM_EHS_R-32_CONTROL_KIT_EU_EN_200822.pdf wired remote manual (with these settings): https://downloadcenter.samsung.com/content/UM/202303/20230323172041115/DB68-08470A-10_IB_EHS_Wired_Remote-Control_Kit1_EU_Book_EN_221130-D02.pdf mixing valve product page: https://esbe.eu/group/products/rotary-actuators/ara600-3-point mixing valve manual: https://esbe.eu/storage/B60B7F4E4E6EF526FB82F154298BC0C84EB31B3FA6A012B10BCBAFCA481C50D8/d3d68f5b77fe48388606ed3bdaf52cd0/pdf/media/ffbc6318cbad46cfaa19e0b559228e0a/Anv_ARA600 3point_98140275_version K_lr.pdf Edited October 17, 2023 by gac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharpener Posted October 19, 2023 Share Posted October 19, 2023 If not here then you might find answers by posting on the Facebook heating design group. There has been some recent discussion of Esbe mixing valves there (though I have not been following it!). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gac Posted October 19, 2023 Author Share Posted October 19, 2023 thanks for the tip! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beelbeebub Posted October 19, 2023 Share Posted October 19, 2023 Is it something to do with the running time.? I note the valves listed have different setting for the running time from open to closed. If your esbe valve was faster moving than expected it could be stepping too much each time. Ie it wants to close a little, so applies a 20 second pulse to close, which would be about 20% on a valve with a 100 second total time, but if your valve had a 15 second close time it would be full operation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gac Posted October 20, 2023 Author Share Posted October 20, 2023 according to the Esbe's manual the runtime for this model is 60sec. when doing the self-test it seems indeed it would take 60sec to fully open/close if shorter that would be a problem for the control kit as 60sec is the minimum very surprised also with this, we live in the modern age, one would assume there is data feedback to know the exact valve position and not just counting passed time and assuming correct functioning of the valve and with the pwm pump, wasn't easy to find explicitly supported pumps, even with grundfos they don't really broadcast this functionality and seeing the different experiences here on the forum, seems I was very lucky to have found one that just worked out of the box (https://www.dimeco.be/product/onderdelen-verwarming/circulatiepomp/oeg-cpa-e-55-15-s-pwm-circulatiepomp/) and was quite cheap too, hopefully it'll last a while 🤞 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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