Building control not interested : should I try to change that?

[andyscotland]

I'm self building a garage conversion/small extension. It includes new drains to new inspection chamber, new ensuite, door openings in existing walls, new rooflights, etc. I did the plans & spec myself (with a lot of research and a structural engineer who provided a Certificate of Design for the structural elements). 

 

I have a building warrant but the council have said (in writing) that they have assessed the project as low risk and won't be allocating me a BC officer or inspecting until I'm ready for completion certificate. I'm to take photos as I go to demonstrate compliance with the approved plans / regs.

 

I'm pretty confident that my plans are compliant, and that I'm building what I drew. My application was pretty comprehensive, included detail drawings of most things as well as the basic plan/section/elevations. I'm taking photos of basically everything along the way, and have a selection of 5 minute videos of nothing at all changing on a drain test which will make riveting viewing...

 

All the same I have an occasional nagging worry that there'll be some small detail that doesn't quite show on the plans, or isn't quite clear in the photos, and they'll make me open things up at the end to inspect it.

 

It's further complicated because I'm not sure anyone at Edinburgh council has actually ever looked at the plans : they contracted the assessment out to Argyle & Bute. The officer there said he reckoned they were to a high standard, but I've heard Edinburgh are known for being quite picky.

 

I'd feel more comfortable if it was inspected in stages in the usual way. Part of me wants to try to persuade them at least to do one visit once the structure is all up. There's loads of (bigger) builds near us so they must be in the area fairly often.

 

But I don't want to make a big drama and seem like I'm not sure of what I'm doing and then get someone out who's actively looking for something to be wrong.

 

What would you do?

[Russell griffiths]

Walk into the local office, talk to head of bc and tell him your thoughts 

i have found mine to be perfectly approachable and very helpful. 

[Triassic]

Mine the same, only visited to inspect half the drains and then for the first stage of the foundation pour, I’ve emailed him since to tell him about the frame going up, he asked for all the structural calcs. I’ve not seen him since.

Edited June 6, 2019 by Triassic

[ProDave]

The good thing about the Scottish system is you have to submit full plans. They have looked at your plans and passed them.  As long as you build to the plans, there should be no issues.

 

BC last visited my site when the frame was finished. They don't want to come again until completion (though I will be getting them out to give me a temporary habitation certificate at some point).

[the_r_sole]

.

Edited September 26, 2019 by the_r_sole

[joe90]

Yup, crack on (with photos as evidence).

[andyscotland]

2 hours ago, Russell griffiths said:

Walk into the local office, talk to head of bc and tell him your thoughts 

i have found mine to be perfectly approachable and very helpful. 

Thanks - I don't get the sense Edinburgh is that sort of council, reckon it's extremely unlikely I'll get to speak to the HoD. They've been helpful a couple of times when you chat to the duty officer, more of a mixed bag by email.

 

@Triassic @ProDave mine has never been on site, not even to look at the drains. The original paperwork they sent said they wanted to see the drains, structure complete and insulation in. Wasn't expecting them every week, but thought they'd do at least one of those.

 

1 hour ago, ProDave said:

The good thing about the Scottish system is you have to submit full plans. They have looked at your plans and passed them.  As long as you build to the plans, there should be no issues.

 

That's very true, guess I'm just nervous there'll be some small detail that's not on the plans or that the surveyor who does the final inspection doesn't like. A neighbour had plans approved but then the BCO on a site visit felt one of the details was not compliant and shouldn't have been signed off and he made them change it. Fortunately was early enough in the build it wasn't too much of a drama. If that happened at completion it'd be hellish...

 

22 minutes ago, the_r_sole said:

Edinburgh are an absolute nightmare in building control - you're better having it assessed by argyll and bute! This is the first time I've heard they have refused to inspect, they usually just don't respond to requests to attend site...

As long as you stick to the drawings and make sure if you're using any products that carry BBA certs, that they are installed as per the BBA - and you take photos - you should be absolutely fine at completion - you could also send photos by email to the named officer on the warrant every now and then just to annoy them. It's a really sad state of affairs in the public sector at the moment, they make a process statutory then don't resource it enough to work, it's absolutely ridiculous

 

That's what I'd heard, but also part of my nerves.

 

I don't even have a named officer on the warrant, it was issued still showing "Argyll & Bute Council" as the named officer. To contact them I have to email the neighbourhood team, who eventually reply signed off "Building Surveyor North West". Appears to be different people each time.

 

There were a couple of small things came up with the drain alterations once we excavated and it was a nightmare getting any sort of opinion. When I've tried to phone or on one occasion visited the counter they just tell me to email.

 

I think the problem is the fees are set Scotland-wide based on what it should cost to run the process, but unlike e.g. parking the income isn't ringfenced so with all the pressures on council funding the BC department is an easy place to make cuts without losing revenue. I used to work with Edinburgh BC years ago on theatre/event licensing and from what I can tell the team is massively smaller than it was then despite the increased building activity in Edinburgh. The people I mostly worked with have retired and not been replaced. It is annoying, it's not like I've had a discount on the warrant fee to reflect minimal inspections etc.

 

[recoveringbuilder]

We have had no visits at all from BC, SE told us they don’t tend to visit like they used to as they are now known as building standards so do things different and don’t pay visits like they used to.

[Bitpipe]

Our (private) BC guy first popped round when we were doing some site prep & drainage to kick it all off.

 

Next visit was when the basement steel was erected and he quickly saw that it was a quality job so didn't stay long.

 

After that we saw him after the frame was erected but before any first fix, he had a few comments for extra things that we sent photos to prove had been done.

 

Came back just before the cavity was closed (plastering) and then did a pre-final inspection and a final inspection.

 

Each visit was very efficient (20-30 mins) and most of our interaction was by email with photos for proof of actions raised plus the required documentation, plans, calcs etc. 

 

This was on a 400m2 house over 4 floors inc. basement and detached garage 

[andyscotland]

10 minutes ago, Christine Walker said:

We have had no visits at all from BC, SE told us they don’t tend to visit like they used to as they are now known as building standards so do things different and don’t pay visits like they used to.

 

That's reassuring. Did they come for the completion certificate? Take it that went smoothly?

[andyscotland]

@Bitpipe thanks - I guess with private BC (not an option in Scotland) it's clearer it's a service you're paying for. My project is a lot smaller than yours so wasn't expecting that level of attention but thought I might have seen them at least once or twice.

[recoveringbuilder]

3 minutes ago, andyscotland said:

 

That's reassuring. Did they come for the completion certificate? Take it that went smoothly?

We haven’t got completion yet still steps and ramp and paths to do!

[andyscotland]

1 minute ago, Christine Walker said:

We haven’t got completion yet still steps and ramp and paths to do!

Ah - fingers crossed then! ?

[Bitpipe]

Just now, andyscotland said:

@Bitpipe thanks - I guess with private BC (not an option in Scotland) it's clearer it's a service you're paying for. My project is a lot smaller than yours so wasn't expecting that level of attention but thought I might have seen them at least once or twice.

 

They were more less the same price as the LA BC, who I'm sure are just as competent but I have heard are overworked and some can be a bit officious and slow to move with the times.

 

There's a bit more of a customer service ethic with the private ones but they won't let anything slide though.

 

Our guy actually saved me a load of hassle - I was all set to put a SVP through the flat roof at the back of the house where our bathroom is, but one thing and another delayed the work.

 

Was not looking forward to it as it was going to be a pain to  make airtight, waterproof and would have generally looked crap.

 

Anyway, the delay gave me the opportunity to discuss an alternative idea I got on this forum (from @JSHarris I think) about having the SVP distant from the house. As we were in a caravan at the rear which was plumbed into the main sewage run, I asked BC if I could put it there and hide it with a planter or something. 

 

He surprised me my saying that as the houses either side had a SVP, I didn't need to bother as the SVP was for the benefit of the sewerage system, not my house and the new rule of thumb in a dense development was one SVP per 10 dwellings!

 

So used AAV instead at the head of the stack and avoided all that hassle - thank goodness for the plumber forgetting his hole saw that day

[AliG]

The guys in Edinburgh building control were surprisingly helpful when I had to get an extension on my last house signed off to sell it.

 

As long as they have approved the drawings you should be fine. The main test they usually like to carry out themselves is the drain test, although they may accept your video.

 

Usual issues are safety and access related. So for example I had to upgrade my smoke detector system to be interconnected which is the current reg but was not when the house was built. They will want to see electrical sign offs, certificates for fire doors if any etc.

 

They were quite reasonable about accepting common sense explanations, like the 6th toilet, upstairs in my games room not having to be accessible.

 

 

[andyscotland]

@AliG yes I was surprised about the drain test but they were not at all interested in coming out. Perhaps they'll want to do another at the end, the ones I did were perfect passes - barely any leakage at all - so hopefully they'll still pass now they're under concrete / buildings / backfill...

 

When I've actually been able to speak to anyone, they've been good - but don't know my project and have been fairly non-committal. It's just I've heard horror stories from others, so it seems like it may depend who you get.

[joe90]

We were not asked about a drain test at all, when the B.I. Visited fir the final visit he just listed the docs he wanted and he would sign the build off.

[andyscotland]

26 minutes ago, joe90 said:

We were not asked about a drain test at all, when the B.I. Visited fir the final visit he just listed the docs he wanted and he would sign the build off.

 

Interesting, did you use a contractor for the drains? I know some are allowed to certify same as e.g. an electrician.

 

Maybe I just need to relax

[joe90]

2 hours ago, andyscotland said:

 

Interesting, did you use a contractor for the drains? I know some are allowed to certify same as e.g. an electrician.

 

Maybe I just need to relax

 

My builder did the drains but i extended them and installed the treatment plant. They are chilled down here?