Besidethewye Posted October 25, 2018 Share Posted October 25, 2018 A quick question (or not!) We have a large triple glazed window (1200 wide, floor to ceiling) - a big ask on the hinges I know but there was no hesitation in supplying it. Tilt and turn. We have had endless problems and over a year now it's never been adjusted successfully. The frame went in with a twist and also has a slope and high spot in the base. The twist is less but not gone now and the window operates as well as it ever has. The adjusters are at the end of their adjustment - window fully up at the hinge side and you can feel it scraping the spacer at the non hinge end. From what fitters have said and my thinking is that over time it's only going to sink and need to be adjusted up to clear the non-hinge end. The latest assurance was that it does not matter that it's at the end of the adjustment as there's no reason it would move. My instinct is that there ought to be plenty of adjustment available to have any hope of the window operating successfully for the 25 years it should be working for..... Any thoughts welcomed and appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpmiller Posted October 26, 2018 Share Posted October 26, 2018 what frame material? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Punter Posted October 26, 2018 Share Posted October 26, 2018 It is up to the supplier to know what size window they are able to supply. It should function correctly. If it went in with a twist it needs reinstalling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craig Posted October 26, 2018 Share Posted October 26, 2018 (edited) Was the unit delivered with a twist in the frame? Was the unit delivered with the high spot? Was the delivery of this noted as received with defects? What has the supplier said about the unit? Did the supplier install it or was it a supply only? It could be an installation issue. The fact that it is dropping can be down to a couple of things but the initial suspect is that the hinges are insufficient for the weight. For that size (1200 x 2100?) and with some suppliers, I would be expecting exposed hinging, that are capable of taken 180KG (we call them mammoth hinging). I would be expecting the supplier to address the twist, rise and weight issue. Edited October 26, 2018 by craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToughButterCup Posted October 26, 2018 Share Posted October 26, 2018 28 minutes ago, craig said: [...] I would be expecting the supplier to address the twist, rise and weight issue. I might have put it a little stronger after a year.... The question now is; why the lack of progress to getting the issues resolved? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted October 26, 2018 Share Posted October 26, 2018 Is it the hinges dropping or the frame the glass is in sagging? In a previous house we had a big UPVC double glazed French door and we had the suppliers back twice as it kept sagging. Basically the UPVC frame of the door was not strong enough to support the weight of the glass and the frame was sagging. They had the glass out and re packed and re glued it in twice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nod Posted October 26, 2018 Share Posted October 26, 2018 11 hours ago, Besidethewye said: A quick question (or not!) We have a large triple glazed window (1200 wide, floor to ceiling) - a big ask on the hinges I know but there was no hesitation in supplying it. Tilt and turn. We have had endless problems and over a year now it's never been adjusted successfully. The frame went in with a twist and also has a slope and high spot in the base. The twist is less but not gone now and the window operates as well as it ever has. The adjusters are at the end of their adjustment - window fully up at the hinge side and you can feel it scraping the spacer at the non hinge end. From what fitters have said and my thinking is that over time it's only going to sink and need to be adjusted up to clear the non-hinge end. The latest assurance was that it does not matter that it's at the end of the adjustment as there's no reason it would move. My instinct is that there ought to be plenty of adjustment available to have any hope of the window operating successfully for the 25 years it should be working for..... Any thoughts welcomed and appreciated. I’m guessing it’s aluminium If so there will be little or no adjustment So the frame has to be a 100% square and plumb Any adjustment is normally done with the glass (toe&heel) If the frame wasn’t perfect when fitted In afraid the only option that will solve your problems Is to take the doors out and refit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craig Posted October 26, 2018 Share Posted October 26, 2018 3 hours ago, recoveringacademic said: I might have put it a little stronger after a year.... The question now is; why the lack of progress to getting the issues resolved? I would have but I was trying to be diplomatic about it and objective by looking at it from both sides and without seeing/knowing the exact ins and outs. It would certainly indicate that a new unit is required and the supplier are dragging their heels over the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Besidethewye Posted October 26, 2018 Author Share Posted October 26, 2018 Thanks all The frame is engineered softwood with ally clad outside. I would say confidently that this is an installation issue - the windows themselves are top notch (and should be). Install was by the supplier. So I would say that the high spot in the base and the twist were added on install. I think the latest attempt to make it work which involved removing the fixings and a set of wedges to try to get the twist out and the base level may well have bent the ends down and put the high spot in the middle of the base. What I want to avoid is a window that sort of scrapes in now but can only get worse over time - and I assume it will sag more over time and need to be adjusted up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roundtuit Posted October 26, 2018 Share Posted October 26, 2018 I had 3 (3g Alu-clad) windows to take out and re-fit (that were smaller than yours) as the frames had a slight bow in them. The manufacturer's view was that it was down to installation, and, to be fair, it was. We took them out, hammered-out the crank in the fixing brackets and re- installed and got them spot on. Probably best to bite the bullet, take them out and have another go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lizzie Posted October 27, 2018 Share Posted October 27, 2018 Ive had someone out today to look at my threshold issue as I have been unable to resolve it with bits and bobs myself. There is no doubt my issue is with the install and complete balls up with the slab pour with no provision being made for the level thresholds (prof proj man and window installer both messed up cant blame slab people they just did what they were told). Some remedial work was undertaken to stop the water ingress ...that water ingress went on for over 6 months and held up the build. This remedial work has left me with level thresholds that sit in thin air. Apart from drainage issue it is a worry that the threshold, which flexes when you stand on it, will bow over time. Ill get back to the point,......... I found a company who happen to be near me and specialise in repairs to ali windows and cladding, commercial jobs but he is going to do something with the thresholds for me. I dont know if they may be any use to you @Besidethewye....if you are near the Wye you would probably come into their 80 mile radius of Brum work area. I can give you website if you wish but I cant recommend as they have not done my job yet. He was a very professional man and knew his stuff though. Waiting for my quote now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Besidethewye Posted October 27, 2018 Author Share Posted October 27, 2018 @lizzie that would be really useful - just in case....do have to work out my level threshold details and the right way to do the drainage and support the slate/stone etc. we had endless trouble with the level threshold thing - for reasons I do not understand none of the notches put in our slab were right (and the slab has an interesting set of slopes in it) so we had to build up as needed under each of them which took a lot of time. @Roundtuit I would love to get the manufacturer to take a look at the installation before it's too late. Will push them to come and see it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Harris Posted October 27, 2018 Share Posted October 27, 2018 Getting the levels right in a slab for Part M compliant thresholds was a pain, I found. Getting accurate dimensions from the door frame suppliers was the main issue. In the end things worked out OK for us purely by luck, as I opted to get the slab level at the door threshold locations the same as the slab level internally, as I just couldn't get any reliable information from the door and window suppliers. My plan was to grind down the slab in the door area if the doors ended up being supplied with thresholds that were over 30mm deep, but in the end I didn't need to, thank goodness. We were fitting 12mm thick travertine up against two of the door thresholds and 12mm thick bamboo flooring against the French windows, both bonded down with ~3mm of adhesive and it turned out that the doors were all supplied with ~28mm deep thresholds, so we've ended up just being compliant with Part M, with a threshold height of ~13mm to 14mm on all the external doors. I can understand why this detail causes a bit of pain and grief, though, if my experience of trying to get accurate dimensions from a supplier was anything to go by. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Besidethewye Posted October 27, 2018 Author Share Posted October 27, 2018 @JSHarris I discovered when the windows arrived that they all sat on 30mm deep 'travel bars' which meant that the windows were 30mm shorter than I had expected - I have no recollection of seeing that anywhere in drawings or correspondence. The change in the relation between height and width would not be obvious to all but the keenest eye.... One thing that the window fitters did say was that when people are looking for level thresholds and putting notches into slabs they should make the notch significantly deeper (further into the room) than needed for the window/door so that they can get at the frame from both sides and not just from the outside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lizzie Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 @Besidethewye sent you a pm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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