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1" Plastic to Copper Connector


Barney12

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Hi, almost certainly a question for our resident eggspurt @Nickfromwales

 

The picture below shows the connector to join the 32mm ground pipe to the 22mm internal pipwork. 

The brass is (I think) just one of those bog standard 1" tank connectors. But the male union thread on the other fitting is plastic.

Whats the best method to join these? I'm concerned that too much PTFE tape/chord could cause the plastic thread to strip or crack.

This joint is going to be buried in the wall so I need to be sure of a permanent connection. 

Ta muchly in advance. 

 

20170729_094544407_iOS.thumb.jpg.d988a65e14b7cf7cd7884fb209666177.jpg

 

Edited by Nickfromwales
Brass not copper :-)
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30 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said:

A bit risky if it's going to be buried. 

If it's not too late, can you get one of these instead ?

 

No not too late. Its a job I need to do next weekend. (Get me with my planning ahead abilities :))

That does look better.

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12 minutes ago, JSHarris said:

I'm with Nick on this, as I have a couple of MDPE to 22mm connections.  I used these: https://www.pipestock.com/philmac/adaptor-kits/copper-connection-kit as they just fit into an MDPE coupler or elbow and convert it to take a copper pipe on one side.

 

So that piece fits inside a coupler?

Doesn't look as though they do 32mm to 22mm though and I don't want to introduce another joint if I can help it. (Although I could run in 28mm until I get to the install position and reduce their as that's accessible).

 

 

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50 minutes ago, Nickfromwales said:

A bit risky if it's going to be buried. 

If it's not too late, can you get one of these instead ?

 

Oh bother. Just noticed that it says "copper". I'm connecting to 22mm Hep2o. Do you think its still OK?

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10 minutes ago, Barney12 said:

 

So that piece fits inside a coupler?

Doesn't look as though they do 32mm to 22mm though and I don't want to introduce another joint if I can help it. (Although I could run in 28mm until I get to the install position and reduce their as that's accessible).

 

 

 

Yes, it fits inside a coupler.  I used 25mm MDPE, as that's about the same bore as 22mm copper, but you could just fit a short length of 28mm copper with a 28mm to 22mm reducer soldered on to get you to 22mm.  I've found these fittings very secure, as the stainless steel grip ring bites hard into the copper pipe, holding it very securely in place.

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I will be the stick in the mud here. I have used the type of mdpe to copper converter that has been recommended. I did not like them and would not want one buried in an inaccessible location.

 

My "issue" is that it's just a rubber bung that gets compressed onto the copper. Even when tightened the copper can still flex / move a bit. Although it never leaked, it did not inspire confidence.  I would much prefer the fitting Barney proposed, at least the copper connects with a proper olive in a brass fitting. I would not worry about damaging the plastic thread, you really would have to overdo the amount of ptfe for that.

 

Actually my preferred solution is a brass sropcock that takes 25mm mdpe at the input and 22mm copper at the output. Those are really bomb proof.

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19 minutes ago, ProDave said:

I will be the stick in the mud here. I have used the type of mdpe to copper converter that has been recommended. I did not like them and would not want one buried in an inaccessible location.

 

My "issue" is that it's just a rubber bung that gets compressed onto the copper. Even when tightened the copper can still flex / move a bit. Although it never leaked, it did not inspire confidence.  I would much prefer the fitting Barney proposed, at least the copper connects with a proper olive in a brass fitting. I would not worry about damaging the plastic thread, you really would have to overdo the amount of ptfe for that.

 

Actually my preferred solution is a brass sropcock that takes 25mm mdpe at the input and 22mm copper at the output. Those are really bomb proof.

 

 

The ones I used (as in the link earlier) had a stainless steel ring to "bite" into the copper, a lip seal that fits around the copper pipe and is compressed to form a seal and a rigid plastic ring that fits under the MDPE fitting compression nut to hold the whole thing together.  There's no flex or movement at all, the whole things is very rigid when tightened up, as the rigid plastic ring engages in the bore of the MDPE fitting to keep thing in line..

 

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Just now, JSHarris said:

 

 

The ones I used (as in the link earlier) had a stainless steel ring to "bite" into the copper, a lip seal that fits around the copper pipe and is compressed to form a seal and a rigid plastic ring that fits under the MDPE fitting compression nut to hold the whole thing together.  There's no flex or movement at all, the whole things is very rigid when tightened up, as the rigid plastic ring engages in the bore of the MDPE fitting to keep thing in line..

 

That sounds a lot better that the fitting I had.  I would put this in the category of a fitting you want to buy from a shop, where you can see it before you buy it, and NOT something to buy mail order, because I can assure you some variations on this fitting are rubbish.

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On 31 July 2017 at 11:55, ProDave said:

Actually my preferred solution is a brass sropcock that takes 25mm mdpe at the input and 22mm copper at the output. Those are really bomb proof.

Nope, I will be the stick ;) 

I greatly dislike putting any metal compression fitting onto plastic ( mdpe ) as I just can't see how a metal olive being compressed onto plastic is ever a good idea. I've done loads when fitting kit supplied by others, but still avoid it on my own jobs. I will also kick in the testicles, anyone who works for me that puts speedfit pipe into a compression fitting. SQUARE in the testicles, and not a glancing blow, btw. ?

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On 02/08/2017 at 09:08, Nickfromwales said:

 

Ta Da! Thanks Nick. Dry pressure in test in progress. A wet test is going to need some thought as I need to get close to 80ltrs of water and antifreeze into the pipes with no mains water connection available yet! I'll have to see if I can rig up a very long hose from the garage. 

 

20170804_151344808_iOS.thumb.jpg.188c2a64c261403199e5834ebbbf459f.jpg

 

 

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I filled and pressurised our UFH with no water supply, using a cheap pressure sprayer, modified with a fill loop hose and valve.  This allowed antifreeze to be pumped in, under pressure, although I had to fill the modified sprayer up a few times.  These things will pump up to around 3 or 4 bar, I think, although I only pumped ours up to 1.5 bar.

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Well the dry test had lost 1 bar of pressure over night :( 

Not sure though if the cheapo dry test thingy from Toolstation is that great? The 15mm push fit connector doesn't exactly feel robust. 

 

I best get some H2O into it and test it properly. @JSHarris What did you connect to the pressure sprayer to fill the pipes?

Edited by Barney12
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16 minutes ago, Barney12 said:

Well the dry test had lost 1 bar of pressure over night :( 

Not sure though if the cheapo dry test thingy from Toolstation is that great? The 15mm push fit connector doesn't exactly feel robust. 

 

I best get some H2O into it and test it properly. @JSHarris What did you connect to the pressure sprayer to fill the pipes?

 

The pressure will change a lot with temperature when using air, so you may not have a problem.  To make the pressure tester, I replaced the outlet hose from the pressure sprayer with a longer length of 8mm HDPE pipe, which sealed tightly to the 8mm pipe fitting on the sprayer, and on the other end I used an 8mm to 15mm adapter, that fitted to the filling loop pipe.

 

It's currently on loan to @jack, who may be able to take a photo of it (I forgot to take any when I made it).

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Not really, it took me two goes to get it to work!  It was mostly good luck, discovering that the cheap pump spray used an 8mm hose, with a compression fitting where it attaches to the pressure bottle.  I happened to have a length of 8mm LDPE pipe, and that fitted directly into the pressure bottle fitting.  This 8mm LDPE pipe takes standard 8mm compression pipe fittings , as long as a brass insert is used.  The rest was easy, just an 8mm to 15mm compression adapter, an standard 15mm NRV, and then a standard fill loop hose.

 

To use it, you just fill the bottle with antifreeze/inhibitor, screw the filling loop hose on to the fill point valve, open the valve and start pumping.  It very easily pumps our ASHP/UFH loop up to 1.5 bar, the only chore is stopping to refill the bottle every few minutes. In our case it's not a big problem, as it's only around 4 or 5 refills to get the system full initially.  When I drained and refilled the system after working on it it was only a single bottle full, as the UFH loops remained filled, as I only drained as far down as the lower manifold.

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