vivienz Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 This is a bit of a cheeky post, but I'm hoping that someone can give me some pointers. I've just arrived at our little home in Brittany, France, for a week's holiday only to find the immersion heater not working. Other than the kettle, this is our only method of heating water and I really, really hate cold showers so I wondered if anyone can give me an idea of what has happened before I have to ring an outrageously expensive plumber/electrician on Monday morning. We have relatively modern electrics, the place was renovated about 12 years ago. It has a consumer unit with all the standard trips for the circuits in the house, one of which is dedicated to the immersion. All other circuits are working normally, but the immersion is drawing no power when switched on. It doesn't cause anything else to trip when it gets switched on. We were last here in May and everything was working then. When we left, we switched off the water and the electrics for the immersion and the downstairs circuit with the fridge. As evidenced by the dust and cobwebs, no one has been in the place between now and then. When we arrived today, I put the water back on, followed by the electricity for fridge and immersion. The consumer unit is a French one, IP40 from LeGrand, if it makes any difference. I've switched off the mains a couple of times, tried emptying and re-filling the hot water tank before again trying the immersion. Nada. Or should that be 'rien'. Can anyone give me an idea of what may be wrong? I don't propose fixing it, but just want to know the correct point to interject with 'your having a laugh' in my very best French at the appropriate point during a conversation with a plumber. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 Do you have (or can you get) a multi meter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vivienz Posted July 1, 2017 Author Share Posted July 1, 2017 Possibly - i will check with a neighbour in the morning, although they're not great for DIY around here. Off to find out the French for a multi meter! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 Yup. Best to try and simply reset it first tbh, if it's got a manual reset / overheat trip on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteamyTea Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 I am going to jump on this thread with my immersion problem (but not trying to hi-jack it). After 30 years it seems my bottom element has gone and I need to replace it (200 lt copper E7 cylinder). What are the chances of getting the one out (I have the tools) after 30 years without distorting the copper cylinder? Is it worth squirting it with WD40 or similar for a few days? Tap it gently, or just wrench at it with the big spanner, or use the box spanner and the short rod? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted July 1, 2017 Share Posted July 1, 2017 The big, proper flogging spanner and some short, sharp knocks with a club hammer I reckon. Might struggle with the box spanner if it's been in there for years. Never thought to try but some penetrating oil beforehand might help I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteamyTea Posted July 2, 2017 Share Posted July 2, 2017 Cheers, when I pluck up the courage and my G/F has had her new bathroom fitted, I shall give it a go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted July 2, 2017 Share Posted July 2, 2017 First thing to watch is that the copper around the boss doesn't start to distort. If there is any sign of corrosion then be VERY careful about how you proceed. At that point, applying some heat with a lamp may do you a favour Hitting it round with a dumpy chisel is the last resort but does work ( usually ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vivienz Posted July 2, 2017 Author Share Posted July 2, 2017 Thanks, chaps. Have located the electrical connections and it does have a re-set button. Will give that a go first thing in the morning before getting a multi-meter. The cold shower wasn't so bad - cooled the sunburn nicely! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vivienz Posted July 3, 2017 Author Share Posted July 3, 2017 I've attached a photo of the electrics point into the immersion and the consumer unit. The immersion doesn't appear to have a test/re-set button, just a temperature and the connections going into it. The consumer unit does have a test button, but I'm not sure that it will make any difference if we can't re-set the immersion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 You need a multi meter to proceed. It's either going to be a faulty mcb or wiring fault (no power getting to the heater) or the thermostat or the heating element. That type of immersion you have, the thermostat plugs onto the top of the immersion. Just pull it and it will unplug. When you have that multi meter you can test to see what has failed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vivienz Posted July 3, 2017 Author Share Posted July 3, 2017 Thanks, Dave. Off to Monsieur Bricolage now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vivienz Posted July 3, 2017 Author Share Posted July 3, 2017 We've put the meter across the contacts into the immersion and there's no current, resistance or much of anything so it appears that the problem is with the immersion, not the consumer unit. There is nothing to unplug at the top of the tank, just a slight raised circular area at the centre, which I assume is something to do with pressure, but that's it. We need to get a different size socket in the morning as ours aren't quite large enough, and then we'll drain it down and see if we can remove the offending part. There is a label near the connection points that says in various languages that the reset button can only be used by the installer; I guess that's because its inside the unit. Thanks again for the help, everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProDave Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 58 minutes ago, vivienz said: We've put the meter across the contacts into the immersion and there's no current, resistance or much of anything so it appears that the problem is with the immersion, not the consumer unit. There is nothing to unplug at the top of the tank, just a slight raised circular area at the centre, which I assume is something to do with pressure, but that's it. We need to get a different size socket in the morning as ours aren't quite large enough, and then we'll drain it down and see if we can remove the offending part. There is a label near the connection points that says in various languages that the reset button can only be used by the installer; I guess that's because its inside the unit. Too many conflicting terms there. With the power turned OFF Put the multimeter in ohms range, and put the probes where the red and blue wires connect in your picture. What reading do you get? (it's usually about 19 ohms) If you don't get close to 19 ohms, then unplug the thermostat, it will just pull off, exposing the two terminals of the immersion element. Put the probes on those two terminals. do you get a reading anywhere near 19 ohms? I don't understand the second paragraph at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 (edited) 13 minutes ago, ProDave said: I don't understand the second paragraph at all? Sounds like his immersion spanner is the wrong size to me? Scrub that, THAT immersion looks odd as in its maybe a bolted flange / rubber gasket & he needs a socket for the nuts? Edited July 3, 2017 by Onoff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 Yup, the last post was not making any sense at all . A multimeter has different settings, one for ohms ( like a horse shoe symbol ) and then you have voltage ( you need AC not DC ) so the 'wavy line' not the flat line . First, as said with the power off, select ohms and take a reading across the red and blue. Then with the power on, select AC volts and do the following in the exact order. DONT FORGET TO SLECT THE CORRECT SETTING EACH TIME YOU USE THE MULTIMETER Place the black probe onto the blue wire and hold it there, making sure your touching the metal probe on the copper wire. Then, place the red probe on the red wire and see what voltage you have. REMOVE THE RED PROBE FIRST AND THEN THE BLACK PROBE OTHEWISE YOU CAN GET ZAPPED BY THE BLACK MULTIMETER PROBE ! What exactly are you going to undo with the socket? I don't think you should proceed any further without touching base here first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triassic Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 What is the red dial for, is that the reset, what does it say on the label ? Maybe you turn it to do a reset? What make is the white tank, what make is the immersion heater? If we knew this we could search for instructions online? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted July 3, 2017 Share Posted July 3, 2017 Red dial will be the temperature setting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vivienz Posted July 4, 2017 Author Share Posted July 4, 2017 The tank model is a Regent 150VMI up to 6 Bar and 230v, it appears to be a French model and the manufacturer appears to be LCIE Electicite. I have tested the ohms and got zero, I then tested the voltage as instructed. and got 230v, so I presume that is indicative of power going in but a dead thermostat. The red dial is the temperature setting. The picture of the immersion is looking at the base of the tank and the 5 bolts seal against a rubber flange and individual rubber washers. I was assuming that with the removal of the nuts this would free the thermostat/ heating element, after draining the tank I hasten to add. Thank you for all the help so far, sorry I haven't been as clear as I would have liked but I hope the information above will help.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onoff Posted July 4, 2017 Share Posted July 4, 2017 (edited) Je ne parle Francais and all that if my O Level French serves me correct but I think what you want is on these lines: The rubbery bit & stat: http://www.adepem.com/PIECES-DETACHEES/CHAUFFAGE/CHAUFFE-EAU/REGENT/894020+REGENT+150+VMI.html & the element: http://www.jeremplace.com/6665-resistance-2500-watts-droite-pour-chauffe-eau.html Between the two links you'll see how the stat pokes down inside. Elements vary in length and wattage so see if you can find that. If you can do that without taking it out and have the new one ready it'll make changing over that much quicker. Sorry, it might as well be in a foreign language! Edited July 4, 2017 by Onoff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vivienz Posted July 4, 2017 Author Share Posted July 4, 2017 Parts all ordered and on their way. Thanks again, all. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteamyTea Posted July 4, 2017 Share Posted July 4, 2017 (edited) Is that a stray earth lead in the picture? (The French think earthing/bonding is for pansies) Edited July 4, 2017 by SteamyTea Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickfromwales Posted July 4, 2017 Share Posted July 4, 2017 10 hours ago, vivienz said: Parts all ordered and on their way. Thanks again, all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vivienz Posted July 6, 2017 Author Share Posted July 6, 2017 On 04/07/2017 at 22:38, SteamyTea said: Is that a stray earth lead in the picture? (The French think earthing/bonding is for pansies) It is indeed! There is a fully connected earth as well but also the 'spare' one just hanging around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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